Tony G., (4/25/2007 6:02:58 AM)

This is ridiculous,this Detroit representative

is only trying for political clout.

This has ALREADY been ruled on numerous time

and the statue of limitation clearly applies.

Look, this was a truly tragic incident, but you cannot convict the guilty parties, they are long since DEAD, so WHY, try to convict the whole city

for the guilt of a few

mike, tulsa (4/25/2007 6:47:06 AM)

Why Tony don't you know it is all about getting some money for the children to spend on baggy pants and shiny cars with bling around their necks.

Thats all it has ever been!

Firstsai, Kansas State University (4/25/2007 10:24:59 AM)

American law provides for a remedy of aggrieved parties. It should be pointed out, that the State of Oklahoma has avoided liability for this issue since 1922, by passing laws that exempted insurance companies from paying damages, seizing private property, and "losing" claims. Reparations were paid to Japanese-Americans "interned" during WWII, Native Americans for treaty violations too numerous to recount, and even victims of the OKC and Twin Towers bombings. Finally, it should be pointed out, that many of the whites who ATTACKED the Greenwood area were deputized or members of the National Guard, and "acting under color of authority." "Mike" reveals his true feelings, when he was unable to develop a sound, rational argument for denying the claim, as opposed to relying on old racial stereotypes and cliches.

K Hale, Tulsa (4/25/2007 12:27:28 PM)

Mike of Tulsa, thanks for showing your ignorance. And, thank God that people who think like you are a minority.

mike, tulsa (4/25/2007 2:20:09 PM)

not ignorance just tired of hearing about a group of people trying to capitalize on the terrible events hear in good ol boy country!

Granted a monument should be made but, money reperations...come on and when does that end? how about the indians, italians and polish in NYC years ago and oh lets not forget the Asians during ww2. Just how much cash do ya need

mike, tulsa (4/25/2007 2:22:30 PM)

oh yes and about the "sterotypes" have ya looked at the kids in the malls latley?

just exactly as described, not stereotyped but reality

Jim, Tulsa (4/25/2007 2:38:52 PM)

To all those who agree the riot was a tragedy, and believe reparations are in order, how much should each individual person pay and to whom?

KRAIG, TURLEY (4/25/2007 3:11:22 PM)

I am glad that there are those who think like me. Just get over it people. You people are so sensitive to issues like this. All you liberal people and your ways of thinking are just what is bringing this country down and silence a great american like Don Imus. If you people did get reparations most likely you all who buy a bunch of caddys and make loud noises with that jungle music. We are behind Sullivan when he said no for the support. Corborn and Inhoff is best to be quiet. We like things just like it is here in Oklahoma, Tulsa epecially, people in their place. Repartions, forget about it. Its not going to happen. We don't want it to happen.

God Bless America

Firstsai, Kansas State University (4/25/2007 3:34:46 PM)

So...you're saying that all those white people who had their money stolen by ENRON should just suck it up instead of being bailed out by the federal government like it did the savings and loan victims? Do you really think that's going to happen...or is it more likely that some elected official will be bribed by a lobbyist to champion their cause? It appears that in this country, (with the exception of Hurricane Katrina) when whites are the "victims," the treasury doors are thrown open, and the government writes blank checks. I cite the family farmers, Chrysler, and most recently, fire "victims" in California. When the "victims" are minorities, they're told to get over it, or it happened a long time ago. Personally, I don't think that any monument that uses public funds to commemorate a tragedy should be built...it serves no useful purpose, but I am willing at least, to listen to arguments from all sides, and facilitate the arrival at a compromise. What "Mike" needs to understand, is that people like him, are the ones who have kept the debate alive, because as long as you give the legitimate arguments short shrift, the plaintiffs are going to continue to look for someone that can be reasoned with. Oklahoma has used every argument to defend it's intransigence on this issue, and it only has one left...the issue of "standing," because with no survivors, there is no case. Oklahoma has always hoped that the survivors of the riots would all die out, and is merely stalling for time. As far are your racial stereotypes, perhaps if you drove by more Black churches on Wednesday or Sunday, you wouldn't see so many baggy pants, or jewelry. Perhaps those people who offend you so much could learn from the way you dress...or string together a coherent sentence? As for "Tony," I'm not in a position to argue points of law, and since the Oklahoma public school system has failed in it's attempt to teach rudimentary Civics to it's citizens, let's try this. There are historical precedents to arguments about statues of limitations. It may also be inequitable to allow a defendant to use the defense of the running of the limitations period, such as the case of an individual in the position of authority over someone else who intimidates the victim into never reporting the wrongdoing, or where one is led to believe that the other party has agreed to suspend the limitations period during good faith settlement negotiations or due to a fraudulent misrepresentation. What this means is, if the defendent (Tulsa) never argued the case in good faith, in an attempt to allow the statute of limitations take affect, there may be grounds for a redress.

As to your comments about the "Detroit representative," this has historically been a white code for "outside agitators...coming down here to stir up our Negroes..." It was the government of Tulsa that caused the "Tulsa riots," by failing to exercise proper supervision and training of it's agents, and the problem was exacerbated by the National Guard, acting under state authority. The resurgence of the Klan during to early 1920's, and the "Red Summer Riots" of 1919, should have cued even the most naive politician of the danger of sending a mob of armed whites into a black community.

FIRSTSAI, Kansas State University (4/25/2007 4:00:10 PM)

KRAIG, TURLEY

You're another example of the deep seated jealously and animosity that prevails among some people in your community. First of all, if white kids didn't buy so much "jungle music" the record producers would go bankrupt...wherever there is a demand, there is a market...I suppose Eminem is Michael Jackson with chronic viteligo. I should point out, that in 2005 Eminem was this number one seller of rap music. Again, "you" people rely on your own ignorance to support biases that reflect a sense detachment from anything meaningful, so you attempt to give meaning to skin color. As long as you can feel superior to others, you don't have to deal with their concerns. Some whites continue to use black stereotypes to justify their biases, while ignoring their own...shall I list them? Finally, I'm glad to hear that you and Sullivan speak for all white people in Oklahoma...that makes the issue a lot easier to deal with.

mike, tulsa (4/25/2007 4:36:15 PM)

well thanks 1stsai from KSU,

you articulate manner suggest's possible intelligence. With all the Imus, Sharpton and Anna Nicole garbage that has clogged the air and print "ways" don't you think it is time to find some real news?

After all as Mayor Taylor points out the Federal courts have allready ruled on this issue. But I guess as most ultra conservative/liberals put it " this must be a decision by an activist judge".

If you don't like the decision than that is what you call it.

The bottom line is that a federal judge not a local billie bob has allready ruled.

Lets get the troops home and improve the economy not flonder in the past sins of the fathers.

ram, Tulsa (4/25/2007 5:02:00 PM)

Okay, so where do these people feel the free money is coming from to fund these laws suits? From the individuals you actually are responsible for the actions? I agree this is a tragedy for Tulsa, but how long are we going to hear about it? Those that are responsible are long gone, and not all the mistakes of the past can be corrected by throwing money at it.

My take is there is very little focus on the tragedy and more focus on how much money can I get from the government because they owe ME! attitude.

If this is true then we need to take this issue back to source and determine what is currently happening in Africa and the genecide that is occurring between the tribal nations that has been going far longer than the racial issues here in the US. Only in America do we allow this to happen.

One Nation Under God! we only hope some day that will happen.

Keep that wedge going, because once wrong we have to keep reminding everyone that YOU OWE ME! just like the Irish, Italians, Jews, Christians did everyday, during their struggles to live and survive during years of oppression in early America! (Sarcasm) The orientals come and want to take advantage of freedoms not found in their own countries, yet these people act like they are the only ones that have been wronged! Let it go!

FIRSTSAI, Kansas State University (4/25/2007 5:26:02 PM)

First of all, that crap you seem to be addicted to, isn't "news," it's raw sewage packaged to give the unwashed masses something to talk about during periods of lucidity. There are no court decisions set in stone. The United States Supreme Court has reversed itself hundreds of times in our history. Even whites are divided on this issue. Some would argue that such an obligation does not obtain in the case of the black holocaust because the wrongful action took place so long ago. Such arguments are specious at best. Indeed, in 1994, seventy-one years after the Rosewood massacre in which white lynch mobs killed blacks and drove survivors into the swamps near a prosperous black community in Florida, Governor Lawton Chiles signed into law a bill (House Bill 591) that provided for the payment of $2.1 million in reparations to the descendants of the black victims of Rosewood.

The point of reparations, is not the money, but a sincere gesture to right a wrong...an admission of culpability. The state has a responsibility to protect the lives and property of it's citizens, and not only did Oklahoma and Tulsa fail to do this, the authority of the law was misused by their agents. If a policeman wrecks your car chasing a fugitive, should you receive "reparations?" What if he fires a tear gas cannister into a home next to yours, and the resulting fire burns down your home? The issue the federal courts ruled on was not the issue of reparations, but the statute of limitations. Since when do whites in Oklahoma recognize rulings from federal courts?

KRAIG, turley (4/25/2007 6:01:43 PM)

FIRSTSAI,it is good that you at a school. You might learn more about this country and the real people who took it and made to what it is today. You people are just talk and not willing to take a stand when it is called for. That is a shame that those po old folks had to fight for your so called cause for reparations. If there is people who really feel that this is a just cause worthy of fighting they should be on the phone and writing letters like I do to the politcal figures instructing them to ignore the Greenwood crap and continue business as usual. We can always depend on you people to holler for a little while and give up. And it is few. You want to impress me March on Washington like Martin Luther the Coon did or like Minister Calypso Farakaun did. Only then i would take notice. Till then you all are just talk, and we will win.

peace homees

KRAIG, turley (4/25/2007 6:13:09 PM)

It is a known fact what certain people do with thier money. and if they did not have thay would take it. Well not my tax money. Can't we just get along and forget about the past? We need stop talking about the riot before another one errupts, June is coming up.

FIRSTSAI, Kansas State University (4/25/2007 6:34:04 PM)

I don't peek into other people's windows to see what they're doing...and if you do, you should know it's against the law. I would also submit, that you don't have the slightest bit of control over what you tax dollars are spent for, and I doubt if you even know. Maybe you should spend more time telling Texans to forget about the Alamo (a myth) or Pearl Harbor (a pre-emptive strike by the Japanese) or 9/11...

mike, tulsa (4/25/2007 6:53:47 PM)

Well 1st I can't believe that the martin comment didn't tweek you a little, I must say that MLK was a great man and Kraig (myself being a long time tulsa resident) I no about but can't even think of defending your redneck attitude from "Turley".

Please refrain from further comment as you only bury your foot deeper into your mouth and all that comes out is embarrassing white trash dribble.

ryan, tulsa (4/25/2007 11:01:01 PM)

Although the crimes were horrible, I disagree with reparations. This is simply too far in the past. It might make a few people feel better to get reparations, but it's not punishing those who committed the offenses. If Tulsa has to pay a judgment, it's hurting people like me. The current residents of Tulsa would pay, not those descendents of people who lived here then. Why should I pay for this? It's not my ancestors' fault!!

If America allows this lawsuit to proceed, then it opens a pandora's box of absurd litigation. Some of my ancestors are Chickasaw. Should I sue for being forcibly relocated to Oklahoma?

ryan, tulsa (4/25/2007 11:01:07 PM)

Although the crimes were horrible, I disagree with reparations. This is simply too far in the past. It might make a few people feel better to get reparations, but it's not punishing those who committed the offenses. If Tulsa has to pay a judgment, it's hurting people like me. The current residents of Tulsa would pay, not those descendents of people who lived here then. Why should I pay for this? It's not my ancestors' fault!!

If America allows this lawsuit to proceed, then it opens a pandora's box of absurd litigation. Some of my ancestors are Chickasaw. Should I sue for being forcibly relocated to Oklahoma?

KC, Tulsa (4/25/2007 11:24:10 PM)

Actually it is punishing those who are responsible...THE CITY OF TULSA!! For those who truly know, they victims weren't able to have their day in court because the courts were 'closed' to them so that they weren't able to receive their reparations. I personally think that reparations are in order. We are talking about THE LARGEST race riot(massacre) in the history of the United States!! Innocent, unarmed people (women and children) were butchered at the hands of LAW ENFORCEMENT!!! And, to this day, we (Tulsa, Ok.) continue to show our consent or approval of this terrible tragedy by remaining silent and not awarding these 'people' what they rightfully deserve. Oh, and by the way, I understand that you didn't "do anything" to those victims, but you are a beneficiary of rape and robbery that occured during that dreadful day. That is not to say that you should be punished but rather that you should understand why your government should be!

mike, tulsa (4/26/2007 6:50:17 AM)

come on kc, "we are a beneficiary of rape and robbery"? Just exactly how and what is beneficial today of the "rape and robbery" that occured 80 years ago?

Today we are the "city of tulsa" so yes actually we will be punished if the city is hit with millions of dollars of reparations.

As noted in the press the city's coffers are not full actualy they are slim, so what services are you willing to do with out to fund these "reparations"?

Maybe no police and fire protection, no street repair or no water and sewer?

How much would be sufficient to you?

KC, Tulsa (4/26/2007 9:50:38 AM)

Well...Mike, interestely enough...there are PRESENTLY areas of our city without adequate use of these services. Moreover, I believe that the reparations issue will help to bring more healing to our city as well as more businesses who are leary of coming to 'ole country, white, racist, Tulsa! We've got to really change our image. The US has already been 'browned!' However, here we stand...Tulsa...racist and white...but that good ole boy standard is being changed here as well and I think this is a grand opportunity for Tulsa to erase and/or make up for a tremendous atrocity that, although we don't really like to admit, is synonymous with our name.Tulsa and Greenwood will ALWAYS be linked together. The question is how do we want to communicate that linkage? "Yeah we did...so what!?? or "Yeah we did it and...here is our attempt to acknowledge and correct our wrongdoings." Now what...?

Paul, Spokane, WA (4/26/2007 2:13:40 PM)

As a Tulsa native, I hate to see the rednecks come out and downplay this time in history. Have some compasion and pull your head out of your @$$. What if this was you. Reparations would be appropriate for certain individuals. Thier whole lives were changed/ruined for many generations because of this.

FIRSTSAI, Kansas State University (4/26/2007 2:16:00 PM)

Welcome to the discussion, KC...

Mike-again, your "slippery slope" argument is specious at best. The law is what it is. If a lawful authority commits a wrong, there should be a remedy. Apparently, some people a lot smarter than both of us found reparations appropriate for the survivors of Rosewood, and it didn't cause the deluge of lawsuits you predict "may" happen here. My willingness to listen to logical arguments on all sides demonstrates that I'm the product of a decent education. Without dragging O.J. Simpson back into an argument, I'd like to point out, that in a criminal trial, he was found "Not Guilty," however, in a subsequent civil trial, he was found liable. Here's my question...why is OJ paying "reparations" for a crime he was found "Not Guilty" of, and of what benefit is this to the survivors and the community? My theory? White people are holding a grudge against him, and will carry it to their graves, yet you can't understand why the survivors of the Tulsa riots feel the same way? Same old story ...minorities in this country cannot be victims unless the perpetrators are also minorities. Their complaints must be dismissed as insignicant. Well here's another thing you didn't know. Oklahoma has a Victim's Compensation Law that provides for a finanancial remedy for innocent persons physically or emotionally injured during a crime. The fund that pays this compensation comes from the taxpayers, and yet, I don't hear you bitching about your money being used to pay people you didn't injure, unless of course, the victims are black.

KC, Tulsa (4/26/2007 3:21:58 PM)

Firstsai...I have to say that I love you! Seriously, I couln't agree with you more. And I truly believe everyone knows that these survivors(and/or their decendants) should be compensated for the terrible atrocity that took place. It is as you said...not okay when the victims are black. It seems that we are yet again faced with another major point of hypocrisy in our country. Furthermore, Mike, many benefitted from the rape and robbery of that riot in that their ancestors stole land, property, etc. that didn't belong to them. These assets were then passed on to their decendants who passed it on and so on and so on. Many whites in Tulsa would not be in the position of affluence that they hold had it not been for robbing, raping, etc. However, many of the blacks who were victims of the act lost all they had and therefore had nothing to pass on to their decendants and ergo the problem perpetuates itself. Our city, our government has the resources to make this thing happen. As stated by firstsai, its not a money issue. States/Cities are insurred to provide in the case of lawsuits(just like the one where the city was sued by the black officers coalition...and by the way they did win that suit). Its an issue of whether or not they(City of Tulsa) are going to acknowledge their wrongdoing and then make it right. Also, I loved the point about O.J., well put!