Pastor Reginald Levi Walker, Tulsa (11/7/2007 10:20:25 AM)

My follow Americans and viewers of this message board:

Something for us all to think about before we stand in judgement.

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(Paraphrased) By the same measure you judge, you will also be judged...

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The prevailing opinion that runs my life, as a child of God is the only thing I think or agree with has to be in line with the Holy Scripture. The Scripture speaks volumes on man and my inability to judge another man’s servant. I also know that through my study during my stay at Shorter College- Jackson Theological Seminary. The belief system of the average American churchgoer has some concepts and precepts that I do find troubling. Nevertheless, as I stroll through the pages of the original text of the Old Testament, I can understand why this has happened.

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The Scriptures vividly and loudly informs us of the wiles of Lucifer to take us off and keep us from doing the things God had created us to do. Like Lucifer, sometimes we deem ourselves more knowledgeable than God. Like Balaam, we sometimes choose to speak prophecy of thing never told to us. Then, it falls upon the almighty omnipresent hands of God to correct his servants.

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Therefore, my fellow Christians, please do not rush to jump into a fight that God has already settled with these word centuries ago.

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Ecclesiastes 3:17

I said in mine heart, God shall judge the righteous and the wicked: for a time there for every purpose and for every work.

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Ezekiel 18:30 Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord God. Repent, and turn from all your transgressions; so iniquity shall not be

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Ezekiel 24:14 I the Lord have spoken: it shall come to pass, and I will do it; I will not go back, neither will I spare, neither will I repent; according to thy ways, and according to thy doings, shall they judge thee, saith the Lord God.

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Incredulous in Michigan, Troy (11/7/2007 10:20:38 AM)

Copeland's partner and buddy, Pat Boone, says Kentucky will become another San Francisco if they elect a Democratic governor. I can't post the link here unfortunately.

Pastor Reginald Levi Walker, Tulsa (11/7/2007 10:21:04 AM)

Romans 14:4 Who art thou that judges another man's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. Yea, he shall be held up: for God is able to make him stand.

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Therefore, I beg that we judge nothing until the Lord come. He will both bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God. I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; do not quickly rush to judge each other so harshly. Think on this: What if those in question were really us. How would we want to be treated? Treat them the same way.

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This is indeed a continuing demoralizing story of Christian corruption and greed. The depths that we have been injured by the well meaning and/or the questionable actions of all of the individuals involved can never be successfully measured because the chasm continues to grow.

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As we continue to travel to the distant future where the actions of these people will be a memory lost in our history books, let us look to God for the healing each of us need. The newspaper expresses and vividly displays the hurts, pains, and agonies that the Christian community and our great country continue to go through. These hurts, pains, and agonies are something that can not be ignored and expected to go away. Indeed, they must be addressed.

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As the children of Israel found themselves suffering under the hard conditions of life in ancient Egypt, they, also found themselves faced with harsh circumstances that brought them much hurt, pain and agony. As they grudgingly traverse the hot dry desert, their hurts, pains, and agonies chased after them. These men hoped to overtake the Israelites and return them to the harsh condition of slavery in Egypt.

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Nevertheless, as the people, united stood by the river complaining about the man God had sent to lead them. Moses lifts his prayers up to God. However, the answer supplied by God was a surprise. ‘And the Lord said unto Moses, Wherefore criest thou unto me? Speak unto the children of Israel that they go forward.’

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In these sad days of disappointment in those we choose to place our spiritual trust in, we now find ourselves looking over of our shoulders as the enemy of hurts, pains, and agony charge over the not to distant horizon.

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Our first thought is to strike out at those who have gotten us in this situation. Then reflective thought along with the guidance of the Holy Spirit moves in. Who put a gun up to our heads and demanded we give? When were we every forced to give? Since, we are free-will living being, who do we blame because we chose to be fooled.

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As we look inside our fallen spiritual heads for answers, the loud proclamation of God rings in our ears. Why cry unto me? My fellow Americans, go forward. Citizens of Tulsa, children of ORU- Go forward because God is not through. Christians - Go forward into the coming blessed promise of God that he will take care and correct his own. Go forward in the words that forever are true; you must forgive before God will forgive you.

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As I sit here at this desk, I view myself as a sinner saved only by the grace of God. Therefore, I choose to go forward in spite of the things those other people do. I refuse to be the one to say I quit God because of the wrong someone has done. Think of the many ways we wrong God each day, still God sent Jesus to stand upon the cross for us.

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There is a job, a cross, we must bear.

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There are other people needing the gospel we share.

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Stop focusing on the problem we are going through.

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God has an important job waiting just for you.

Our salvation should be so important to us that we do depend on the thoughts of someone else to lead us to God. This is the reason we must stop just foolishly taking these preacher, pastors, and teachers at their word. Every man is capable of lying or being wrong, even myself. Th

Pastor Reginald Levi Walker, Tulsa (11/7/2007 10:22:36 AM)

There are true false prophets out here waiting to tear some unexpecting young Christian’s faith apart.

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I am neither defending nor condemning the actions of any of the involved parties in the recent Christian publicity nightmare. Rather as a child of God, I voice my opinion. My opinion is as the Scriptures states in Acts. (Paraphrase) After the good people of Berea finished listening to what Paul and the others had to say they went home and searched the Scripture for themselves to see whether or not what was said was true.

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However, I pray that the God that we serve will enlighten each of us to understand, ‘ In order to be misled, one must first choose to be led.’ I repeat do not get mad at the ones that fooled you into believing what you believe and for failing to live up to your expectations. We have the Scriptures in over 120 different interpretation. Why did we not just simply check it out for yourself instead of simply believing what another man states what it might say. Each of us are sinner fallen short of the glory of God, so why would we expect more of someone else than we do of ourselves.

In order to be misled, one must first choose to be led.’ The old saying goes 'You can lead a horse to water, but you can not make it drink.' The same applies to each of us. We are free willed living being. We have a mind of our own. We know what the bible says. Nevertheless, for the life of us, we refuse to read it for ourselves. We lend upon the knowledge of our pastors, teachers, and preachers to tell us everything we need to know about a God that said in James, (paraphrase) If we desire his wisdom all we need to do is ask him and he will give it to us.' Yet, we spend all our money on the knowledge of fallible man.

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I repeat do not get mad at the ones that fooled you into believing what you believe and for failing to live up to your expectations. The Scripture instructs us to try the Spirit by the spirit. Paul tells us numerous times to beware of false teachers spreading false doctrine. When was the last time you held your claps or Amens until you checked out what you were agreeing to?

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By the same measure, we judge others; by this same measure shall we be judged. Let us trust in the correcting hands of God to judge his servants. He has placed the authorities in place just for that purpose. If they do not judge the situation correctly, God will in the end.

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Pastor Reginald Levi Walker, Tulsa (11/7/2007 10:24:13 AM)

If you know and experience the stove being hot, nevertheless you listen to the advice of a friend to touch it.

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Whose fought is it that you were burned? You or your friend.

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God gave us the warning signs a long time ago. Since we did not pay attention to it, we were burned. We knew what to look for, but we did not look, so really, who is to blame?

I do not intend to hurt anyone feelings by tell you the truth. Nevertheless, my only concern is to get myself to heaven and be invited to stay after the lamb's book of life is read.

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I am currently living for the last 20 years only by the grace of God despite having a fatal deadly disease, nevertheless I do not complain. I just continue to help people n spite of the daily pain I must endure. I do this not because I want man's praise or man's glory. I do it simply because on the cross Jesus bore the pains of my sins for me.

There are many disagreements with what the bible has to say. Nevertheless, it does not change the fact that God does not disagree with what He has said. Moreover, frankly, that is really the only opinion that really matters.

In the final hours of my quickly disappearing life, my prayer for each of you will simply be God forgive them for they know not what they do and do not realize the intent of the words they say.

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One last bit of insight before I go.

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I say to you, that every careless word that men shall speak,

They shall render account of it on Judgment day.

For by your words you shall be justified,

And by your words, you shall be condemned.

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As always, God bless each of us,

Pastor Reginald Levi Walker

Brandi, Tulsa (11/7/2007 10:25:20 AM)

Billy Joe D. is the real deal. Some of the tv and radio pastors/evangelists may not be on for the right reasons, but they are not all crooks. The purpose of being on tv and the radio is to get God's message out to a hurting world that needs Him! I have heard that Victory's new building is completely paid for, no debt. And "seeding and harvesting" is biblical. Without money (with the real deal's) they can not help the needy. For example, Billy Joe has the ministry in North Tulsa that help many needy people. Some others, like Joyce Meyer, have MANY missions within the US and outside. Her ministry gives medical services, fully supports many orphanages, wells are dug for drinking water. Her ministry has had many outreaches for prisoners, tsunami relief, hurricane Katrina relief, and so much more. I most recently heard of housing that her ministry has built that gets prostitutes and their children off the streets. We need more people like this in the world! I agree that the ones who have things to hide, need to be brought to light. But there are, also, ones with a true heart that do wonderful things for our world and for God's glory. God is alive and real. We shouldn't dwell on the ones who fail, but pray for them and do our part to make this world a better place and most importantly to show God's love.

MO Alum, (11/7/2007 10:26:03 AM)

I want to return to a repeated theme. People have the right to believe weird stuff and give money to preachers who preach it. What you or I think is goofy and scandalous from a biblical view has no bearing on their rights.

There are legitimate legal issues here about financial transparency and effective board control for non profits. Don't miss these because you don't like WOF preachers or their message. I do agree with whoever said the last thing any Christian should want is a nfp SOX law. However, issues such as pastoral/ministry compensation, hiring of family members, and the like are by their very nature influenced by theology. How much should the pastor of a 10,000 member church make? The only way to answer that is too take a position on what the bible says. Does this let people off free if they say praise Jesus as they pass the plate?

No the IRS in reviewing the rules for nfp can address these without restricting religious freedoms. They could say that as a condition of receiving nfp status you must define a compensation philosophy and have executive salaries set by an outside group in accordance with that philosophy. They can require that executive compensation information be available to donors. They can require that related party transaction be disclosed as they are in other charities. None of these would restrict what was preached or hinder the free exercise of religion.

Lastly

Jeff, (11/7/2007 10:26:09 AM)

Awww what a cute pic of the 2 men arm in arm. If that is not gay I don't know what is. They do look good together though.

very sad, (11/7/2007 10:28:13 AM)

53. 11/7/2007 9:21:31 AM, Incredulous in Michigan, Troy

Yes, the $23,000 marble commode belongs to JOYCE MEYER.

-How in the world does anyone even THINK to do something like this, let alone shop for it? Do you realize how time consuming all of these fruitless pleasures take in a person's life. I mean I thought they had their noses in God's word for all of us...I would think it would take up a lot of time sitting in a study room dreaming up new understandings of scriptures such as many of these people do.

-This is NOT WHAT THE GOSPEL message is all about. These people on TV for the most part do NOT represent Christ...they represent their hearts desires and a way to obtain it, perhaps feeling justified.

-Joyce Meyers has made no bones about believing she and her family deserve all these things...I will not pay for her and her family to live like this...no matter what good her ministry does...you can find better or local ones that do the same just not on a big scale perhaps.

Joe-Allen Doty, Tulsa, Oklahoma (11/7/2007 10:31:11 AM)

# 66. Gail, Tulsa, Ok

"Issuance of honorary doctorates has been a great concern for me. Joe-Allen, you and I have attended many, many years in universities...and it is tedious with much labor..and it should be. Equating self-study versus studying under professors is much different. It is going to bite them"

. . . Northeastern State was not yet a university when I attended there. I did go to one summer session as a grad Spanish student at the University of Oklahoma and that was right after I EARNED the BA in Education from NSC. While an undergrad and even a grad student at NSC, I took more than a full-load of classes at times. I went 5 years and 2 summers at NSC. Then I was an ORU Grad Theo student for five semesters as a full-time student, too.

I had mentioned days ago about my friend Gary who got his MEd from Northeastern State University and us talking about the way that ORU was wildly handing out honorary doctorates to preachers who had not even gone to college. Gary told me, in words to this effect, "Considering all of the formal advanced education you have, you should just tell people you are 'Dr. Doty,' too."

. . . There is a gloom and doom prophet who is on Christian TV. He goes by Dr. too. I wrote to his organization and found out that while he has an earned Master's degree in the Bible, he never did any work towards a PhD.

Incredulous in Michigan, Troy (11/7/2007 10:31:53 AM)

I agree very sad. There is NO WAY people would be giving her their money, if they knew she was SQUANDERING it like that, and the same goes for all the other 5 under investigation.

OHMYGOSH, (11/7/2007 10:32:52 AM)

#97 SAID..."I would think it would take up a lot of time sitting in a study room dreaming up new understandings of scriptures such as many of these people do."

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Maybe she studies while sitting on the $23K potty.

Gail, Tulsa, Ok (11/7/2007 10:35:11 AM)

#95:MO, Alum: AMEN! The US economy is based upon capitalism....supply and demand. As long as there is a demand...there will be a supply. We each must become aware of the gospel...and be responsible for the resources we have been blessed with whether it is finances, time, etc.

Just Me, Orlando (11/7/2007 10:36:35 AM)

In the past, I sent money to these ministries. I want it back. Can we demand a refund?

very interesting, Tulsa (11/7/2007 10:36:53 AM)

#101 - OHMYGOSH - You are BRILLIANT! "Maybe she studies while sitting on the $23K potty." That's how the potty ends up being "non-profit"!

Incredulous in Michigan, Troy (11/7/2007 10:38:50 AM)

For Just Me: A GREAT question. I believe there will be class action lawsuits on behalf of donors coming next.

Joe-Allen Doty, Tulsa, Oklahoma (11/7/2007 10:43:43 AM)

MR. REGINALD WALKER, your service in the US military does not give you the Biblical right to address yourself as "pastor" in public forums on Newspaper websites.

. . . While this is a discussion forum about "Christian" preachers," it is not a forum for you, REGINALD WALKER, to preach to us who post comments here. You need to stick the the purpose of each of the Tulsa World Articles.

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I am a US Army Veteran and I have one year of duty in Vietnam, too. I went to the Muskogee VA Hospital's Tulsa Out Patient Clinic twice this week and I will be going there on Friday morning to catch the shuttle bus down to the Muskogee VA hospital to have a special procedure done (I call that one of those "looking up my address" examination thing. I sort of dread doing it but it has to be done). While I have a low disability rating with the VA, I am still an officially disabled Vietnam Veteran. My VA ID card even says so.

Brandi, Tulsa (11/7/2007 10:47:24 AM)

I forgot to mention that some pastors/evangelists, like Joyce Meyer, also make money (lots of money) off of top selling books they have wrote and other teaching resources. They don't just get money from people's "seed" gifts. Some of you guys should read some of her books. They are life changing. Might give some of you a better attitude =)

honestly, Tulsa (11/7/2007 10:48:19 AM)

The senator should get the US Postmaster involved as well

Incredulous in Michigan, Troy (11/7/2007 10:49:33 AM)

Baloney TV preachers are "supply and demand". These Protestant prosperity pimps are GREATLY over represented on TV, because they get people to send in their money, saying they will see a 30-100 percent return on their money, thus giving them the money over mainstream preachers to buy TV time.

Just Me, Orlando (11/7/2007 10:49:59 AM)

Incredulous - they should. It's my money, and if it is discovered that it was used illegally, I want it back. I doubt I'm alone. I'll be keeping an eye out for any class actions.

Joe-Allen Doty, Tulsa, Oklahoma (11/7/2007 10:50:16 AM)

The American Baptist Church was originally the Northern Baptist Church which was created when those Baptists in the Northern US States decided that it was not scriptural for Christians to buy slaves to work on one's property. The Baptists in the Southern States used the "authority" of the Old Testament to enslave people and they thought God approved of it.

. . . I used to be an active member of Tulsa's All Tribes Community Church, an American Baptist Church with a special ministry to Native Americans, while being open to all who wished to attend. I was not the only Pentecostal person who who attended. One could go to a non-Indian church for morning worship service and go to ATCC on Sunday afternoons. Oh, there were also Charismatics who were regulars, one family also belong to VCC.

Gail, Tulsa, Ok (11/7/2007 10:51:31 AM)

#108:Brandi: Let me ask you a question. If Ms Meyer's would take her salary only from her book income and refused to take an income from the ministry wouldn't that be a better witness?

honestly, Tulsa (11/7/2007 10:51:52 AM)

The books are written by ghostwriters ... that is fraud as well

Pastor Reginald Levi Walker, Tulsa (11/7/2007 10:53:03 AM)

106. 11/7/2007 10:43:43 AM, Joe-Allen Doty, Tulsa, Oklahoma

MR. REGINALD WALKER, your service in the US military does not give you the Biblical right to address yourself as "pastor" in public forums on Newspaper websites.

. . . While this is a discussion forum about "Christian" preachers," it is not a forum for you, REGINALD WALKER, to preach to us who post comments here. You need to stick the the purpose of each of the Tulsa World Articles.

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I salute you as a fellow vetern of the mlitary.

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The U. S. Constitution clearly states that I am gauranteed the right to LIFE, LIBERTY, and THE PURSUIT of HAPPINESS.

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Therefore, this is my life I live. I take the liberty to express my opinion on anything that effects or affect my life. Lastly as I live this life and enjoy my liberty,I will continue in my pursuit of happiness to preach in season and out of season and voice my U.S. Constitutional guaranteed freedom of speech.

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As Always, GOd bless each of us,

Pastor Reginald Levi Walker