bearway, (8/20/2008 6:05:36 AM)

HR,

So, the constitution is silly. Because we still enjoy civil liberties the world is really gone to crap? Thank You Mr Hitler wannabe. We don't need your kind around here. Let's all hope the animals who did this are caught and justice is served.

AmazedOkie, (8/20/2008 6:40:25 AM)

Bearway, ignore Annette...err Hunters Revenge, She lives only to post on every story that see finds...

QLC, (8/20/2008 6:43:26 AM)

bearway,

hunter wants to decide what your rights will be. yesterday she was saying that she didn't have guns but it was ok for us to have one. now, nobody. soon, she will forbid alcohol.

Lawrence, Tulsa (8/20/2008 7:27:47 AM)

Did the OSBI really think the killer would just walk in and hand them the gun they used in the murder?

olddude, (8/20/2008 7:35:51 AM)

Hr is right people should only have rifles.that way they can shoot you from long range,get real.

okie ridgerunner, small town (8/20/2008 8:11:12 AM)

QLC, -We sure Would not want to forbib or outlaw alcohol. our prisons would have to make more room for the bootleggers. and the state would still be loaded with mentally impaired drunks. like it is with all the rest of the dopey drug users. even tho alcohol kills and causes more deaths in the state than guns do. so to the gun loving alcohol drinking dope users,they should be able to do what they want too. so we can go on having our news of killing and murder. that is the way some of you make it sound. --- Annette ---Hunters Revenge, -has a right to her comments. just like the rest of us. and you are not important enough to be her judge.

jestergrl, (8/20/2008 8:27:35 AM)

I guess those that can legally carry guns now must carry rifles in their holsters according to revenge. Get real. Can you see people walking around with rifles. Haha.

jestergrl, (8/20/2008 8:31:31 AM)

If I was involved in a murder and wanted to get rid of the weapon there is no way I would sell it at a pawn shop or give it to someone. It would be somewhere in some remote location in a lake once it was stripped and scattered from one lake to lake.

Bart78, (8/20/2008 8:46:33 AM)

FTA:

"They can have any number of reasons" for not volunteering, Brown said. "They could be against it, they could be anti-government, or they eventually may want to help."

*****************

Or they could simply understand the Fourth and Fifth Amendment to the Constitution, Ms. Brown.

madmom, wetumka (8/20/2008 9:06:38 AM)

dont you think that everyone is missing the big picture here? i mean arent we supposed to be finding killers, brutal killers! i dont care who has a gun or for what reason but if we as a community do not put all our differnces aside and help, these awful people will continue to be free and could be living next door to any of you. just a thought, has anyone heard anything about taylors biological parents?

QLC, (8/20/2008 9:09:22 AM)

okie, i'm sure you had a point, but i can't quite make it out. were you being cynical or ??? I think annette had hunters revenge pegged pretty good. Actually, I am trying to decide which signon id she used to be.

kitty, (8/20/2008 9:46:11 AM)

has anyone contacted a physic,,, they see all and know all... and if they are real the police should hire them to help them look for killers and rapist and so forth... come all you claravoint people out there

sauerkraut, (8/20/2008 11:07:42 AM)

Jestergrl nailed it. I would grind it up, or cut it up with a torch, melt it or just make it go away, Chop it up and scatter it in rivers and lakes whatever it took. It's not rocket science.

redbeard, Stillwater, Stillwater (8/20/2008 11:17:56 AM)

You would think the murder weapon would be at the bottom of a river somewhere, but sometimes the cops get lucky, or someone rats an accomplice out. You never know.

If it was a local person that shot these kids, someone in the area has an idea of who it was.

I would also check .40 cal ammo sales in the area.

bluemanswhites, Tulsa (8/20/2008 11:34:13 AM)

Eventually some Oklahoma lawman like the late Pete Weaver (that name ring any bells?) will come up with some poor sap like the late Gene Leroy Hart to hang this awful crime on and all the Billy Bobs can slap each other on the back for a job well done, then we can all sleep better at night. I'm so sorry for those close to these young girls...this is Oklahoma Law Enforcement at it's best.

Rex Brinley junior, (8/20/2008 12:20:37 PM)

For me Weleetka has good, bad, and outright weird aspects. The good is The Roundup. I take people up there for lunch and dinner and I still cannot believe how they can crank out food for the quality and price. The bad is when I stopped at a fuel station. The home town cronyism was a bit much for me to take. These high school kids that looked like walking refrigerators came in to buy some skoal. They swaggered in like they owned the place and grabbed hands full of skoal containers then went out the door saying "Put it on dad's tab." The weird was two things. First the elevator lift at First Baptist Church. Oh my Lord. Its a metal frame with a garage door opener hooked up to a block and tackle. I wanted to come back on a Sunday just to see some bloak go up in it. The other thing was the police checkpoints. I know its just a seasonal thing, but it was a strange conglomerate of sheriff, police, tribal police, OHP, and I believe OBN. I could only ask, whom got credit for what if they did a bust? Which they did when we left the town that day.
Thus my experience with Weleetka which I could see how somebody could easily hide as long as they have. Its mixed in with muddy roads and the winding river.

bm, Tulsa (8/20/2008 12:23:49 PM)

-----------
"The other 15 or so gun owners who did not show up will be checked by the OSBI to see why they didn't volunteer for the test firings.

"They can have any number of reasons" for not volunteering, Brown said. "They could be against it, they could be anti-government, or they eventually may want to help."
-----------
Or they could be believe in the Second Amendment, which is constantly violated by our government.
This smacks of a violation of the 2nd Amendment to me. You don't send out a letter to gun owners asking them to volunteer, and then harass them when they refuse. I'd be calling the NRA.

Okie Dutch, Tulsa (8/20/2008 1:06:57 PM)

I'm a strong believer in the 2nd amendment. But I'm also a strong believer in finding criminals fast and putting them in a cage quick. If I had a .40 Glock, I'd be first in line to let law inforcement test fire and eliminate mine. Narrow it down, pin it down, then find and cage these animals.

PS to jestergirl and others: The profile for someone who would pump round after round into someone else's children has got to be cold mean and dead stupid. Let's not give them any suggestions on how to dispose of their guns. If they're not scared, they may still be holding them.

Fred, (8/20/2008 1:12:42 PM)

Most .40 caliber Glocks are purchased at gun shows for cash and there is no background check or record of the purchase. Why do the police think that a person who had a background check done on them before the pawn shop or Gun Store sold them a gun, would use it to kill?

This person or these people don't obey laws. They have as much respect for laws as they did for the little girls.

Fred, (8/20/2008 1:22:50 PM)

I have purchased hunting rifles and shotguns, and every time I had a background check done on me. Gun shows are the best way felons and mentally unstable people can get their hands on a pistol. A background check is not made, and nothing is recorded. It is all done in cash. The NRA wants it this way. I say pistol because you don't hunt with a pistol. The pistol is there to help you settle arguments or defend you from others with pistols or just to be used to easily kill people. Remember, "Guns don't kill people. Bullets moving very, very fast, kill people."

Okie Dutch, Tulsa (8/20/2008 1:38:53 PM)

A horrible truth: Most of the time, who kills kids? Other kids. Where do they get guns? They steal Daddy's guns, have some target practice fun, then put them back. Why does the OSBI want to screen regestered owners? Guess...

H_Harl, (8/20/2008 3:04:38 PM)

hunters revenge, the average joe is allowed to have a handgun for the same reason he's allowed to speak freely or practice his religion.

H_Harl, (8/20/2008 3:08:00 PM)

okie, i agree 100% that hunters revenge has a right to her opinion. and a right to voice it. and i'd defend that right. but, others also have just as much right to think she's wrong. and a right to voice that opinion, also.

H_Harl, (8/20/2008 3:10:01 PM)

madmom, very good point. i agree completely.

Royce, Tulsa (8/20/2008 4:57:35 PM)

People who intend to murder other people do not use registered firearms to accomplish their deed, particularly their own,

This is the insanity in the liberal's gun law position.

Between the state, federal, and local governments New York City has the most stringent gun control laws in the country, yet in New York City it's easier for a kid to get a firearm than it is for him to get a library card.

Make it illegal to own a firearm and the only folks who will have them are law breakers.

bearway, (8/20/2008 9:23:11 PM)

Fred,

Do you have any stats to back up your wild claims? Or are you pulling your "facts" from your backside? I have hunted with a handgun, ALL transactiona at Gunshows are not in Cash, they are NOT the main source of 40 Glocks, and I would bet you do not own a firearm at all.

Goober....

Alice, (8/20/2008 11:59:54 PM)

I think a lot of police departments are using Glock .40-caliber pistols now, I wonder if they are testing law inforcement weapons also.

John in Fairland, Fairland (8/21/2008 1:19:49 AM)

Ms. Brown is stretching the truth. This tactic is used when you are searching for the owner of a specific individual firearm. Using it to create a list of any owners of a type of firearm is clear misuse and invasion of the gun owners privacy. The question I'd really like her to answer is this: If it were discovered that these two children had been run over repeatedly with a blue automobile, would she then proclaim it "reasonable" to require anyone in the "area" who owns a blue automobile to submit it to testing....to prove they're innocent? Kind of flys in the face of "innocent until proven guilty" doesn't it? Seems like this would be a great time for the magic "...15 or so..." to remind Ms. Brown of their rights under the 4th and 5th amendments of the constitution.

W.Moore, (8/21/2008 2:02:55 AM)

Alice raised an interesting question about law enforcement officers weapons. Aren't we all equal under the law?, or in the volunteer line in this case. The post regarding roadblocks being a seasonal thing from Rex Brinley made me think of the road blocks and check points being used in parts of D.C. now, and this article about a "lock down" in West-Helena Ark. Those concerned about any of the "amendments" might want to read the article. And since the Tulsa World uses censoring try to google "info wars West- Helena Arkansas"

Defender, (8/21/2008 10:16:35 AM)

Don't forget a major issue here -- when the OSBI sent letters to these people asking them to "voluntarily" submit to an illegal and unconstitutional search and siezure, don't you think they were just a little bit intimidated? And the OSBI attitude expressed in the original article is pure Gestapo thinking.

And what kind of silly police work is this? "All suspects come forward and be tested" is not only against our laws and constitution, it is flat silly. Is there anyone out there that thinks the scumbags that did this are going to step forward and give evidence to the OSBI.

Let's get real. And let's tell the OSBI we expect more professional investigative procedures from here on.

crb1177, Stillwater (8/21/2008 12:17:09 PM)

This sort of blindly casting a net investigative method is not only invasive of people's constitutional rights, it is one of the most idiotic idea anyone has ever had. The police should be ashamed to admit to this level of stupidity -- it goes beyond desperation born out of a complete lack of talent and intellect.

If you don't know how to conduct an real professional investigation, don't just run around like idiots and advertise that fact to the whole world with such an inane idea. The odds of this sort of moronic idea actually working and the cost to these citizens to go down and have their guns tested shows just how bright and thoughtful our "authorities" are these days.

This story is a great example of why people NEED to be armed. There is no way that rational citizens who see this type of police conduct should be foolish enough to have a drop of faith in "law enforcement" to protect them from crime. When you read this article you see clearly where the dumb cop characters on come from like Chief Wiggums and "Reno 911" -- apparently those are very accurate depictions of the mental capabilities of our police.

mrm, Glenpool (8/21/2008 12:41:33 PM)

Bluemanswhite - Mr. Hart's FINGERPRINT was on the neck of one of the girls! Mr. Hart was no one's scapegoat.

Rex Brinley Junior - I have spent quite a bit time in that area and the people you describe are a minority. The majority of the people who live in this area are hard working, decent, tax paying, law abiding people. And by the way, they typically aren't fat either.

RickJames, (8/21/2008 1:35:25 PM)

The reality is this: Most crimes are NOT committed with legally owned firearms. The legal owners can offer theirs up if they want; that isn't the scary part. The scary part is that they can find who bought what, when. I don't need a license to use my first amendment right...But when I want to use the second, people keep tabs.

That said, I hope they catch and fry the scumbag.

J3ST3RM4A3, Bartlesville (8/21/2008 8:01:42 PM)

Three words...

GET A WARRANT!

HiredGun, (8/21/2008 11:11:22 PM)

40 cal. glock.... used by many law enforcement agencies.....................

okie ridgerunner, small town (8/22/2008 4:35:47 PM)

H-Harl-- you are right. I agree with you.

thinker, (8/22/2008 9:36:29 PM)

Hunters Revenge

I like your picture.....
don't agree with your comment....but the picture is cool.

RickJames, (8/22/2008 10:31:33 PM)

I really don't like for law enforcement to be combing through dealers' records looking at everybody's name, address, type of gun etc., etc. unless they are searching for a particular name. If they request the dealer to "Please check your bound book and see if John Smith has purchased a gun from you in the last year." that would be O.K. if "John Smith" is a suspect in a gun related crime. It's really none of the government's business what guns I own as long as I don't use them to commit a crime. This is a gross invasion of gun owner's privacy rights. Oppose it.

gideon, (8/23/2008 1:01:24 AM)

Do ya REALLY think that... A - the murderer will use a registered gun, B- taht the killer bought the gun from a licensed dealer, and C- that he will gladly take his letter and show up at the police station with the gun he used. What a waste of time! Another example of trageting the legal owners looking for a criminal in their midst... after all, they own guns, they MUST be guilty.

Why buy a gun at a licensed dealers when you can buy one for half the price through the black market that gun control has created.

gideon, (8/23/2008 1:05:23 AM)

Take the gun, ram a steel rod down it's barrel. Twist a few times. Take a needle and hammer and smack the chamber a few times to obscure and change the marks. What they are trying to do is a waste of time. The gun came from GunLeggers - the gun prohibition version of bootleggers.

tulsa_common_sense, (8/23/2008 2:36:13 AM)

sorry but you do hunt with pistols. ever have to finish an animal? you dont do it with a rifle. you walk up and do it with a pistol. as far as rights being trampled? no its not they asked if they would, then those who dont will be asked why they didnt. when they answer its over with but its a good point to do this and very common.

REM1875, (8/23/2008 5:19:50 AM)

"I say pistol because you don't hunt with a pistol. "
Dear Fred - I personally find it a little hard to work on the ranch carrying a rifle or shot gun. Plus I am a little skittish of shooting a copperhead up close on rocky soil with an 30-06 due to the painful shrapnel back blast I will catch. Get real- a handgun is just another tool like work gloves or a fencing hammer that I carry for a good reason that has little to do with shooting others.
Hand gun hunting is a major sport and a blessing to the elderly or disabled. And dont try and cofuse people here with the old saw handguns are underpowered as many modern calibers are more powerful than most deer rifles used up till the 1920's and they worked just fine. Just because you don't use a handgun to hunt does not mean everyone else doesn't and should not have too. I suspect you really are not a hunter. Just another wolf trying to fit into sheep's clothing.

opaww, (8/23/2008 5:51:31 AM)

First I wish to say my hart felt sorry goes out to the families of the two victims.

Now the rest, there are too many ifs in this story to make a rash judgment in the case. But calling on all .40 cal Glock owners to submit their handgun for analyses as to whether it was used to kill these two girls is paramount to guilty until proven innocent. Once you submit your handgun then they can remove you from the suspect list? I don’t think so, sense anyone with a wooden nickels worth of knowledge of firearms can change the ballistic finger print of any given firearm enough so as to remove suspicion of that being the firearm used in a crime.

Now we need to look at the type of firearms possible used, was it a Glock or are they assuming it to be so sense many people seem to believe that only Glocks are in .40 cal. Why could it of not been a Smith and Wesson in .40 cal that was used? Or maybe a Taurus, Colt or any other handgun that is of a .40 cal? What about the possibility of a MP-5 in .40 cal?

Why are they assuming that the slime bag that did this resides in the area? They could have been passing through headed some place else when they saw the victims in the right area at the right time. Maybe they don’t live here but come to visit there from time to time so they may know the area.

As someone pointed out what about the law enforcement, should they not also submit their weapons for testing? Sense many use exactly that a .40 cal Glock as their service weapon. They should not be above suspicion just because they are law enforcement. We know that they also are just like many others in society some are good people and some are bad people. So let us assume their guilt until they are proven innocent as is being done with non-LEA’s that owns a .40 cal Glock.

Why have the OSBI conducted its investigation to a small area? Why not double the size of the area around the seen of the crime? Nothing should be ruled out. I say search far and wide, take no chance that the slime bag just lives close at hand.

Why is not the FBI in on this investigation? It affects every American across the United States. The cold-blooded heinous crime of this type should be paramount in a Nation wide effort to find the slime bag murder/s.

Two deferent weapons used does not mean that two people were involved. It means two deferent weapons were involved.

Every person of any descent morals should be helping to find this ass hole/s if not for the two victims then do it to put a stop to the possibility of more victims in the near future. Even a gang member should look down on this type of crime and offer help as they can. Every Law Abiding gun owner should be out raged at some one committing this crime and jump at the chance to help out.

opaww

proud2be.ndn, indian country (8/23/2008 6:46:51 AM)

Because the test firing of the weapons is voluntary, Brown said there isn't any constitutional violations involved.

GRAMMAR: the word "violations" is plural; there AREN"T any ....

madmup43, Broken Arrow (8/23/2008 8:07:03 AM)

Over 100 people die on roads and highways every day - that's only about 36,500 men, women and children every year - perhaps we should outlaw cars, trucks, and build no more roads or highways. Revenge has a right to her opinion under the First Amendment and you know what they say about opinions, "opinions are like certain body orifices, everyone has one!" We also have a Second Amendment to the Constitution.

okie ridgerunner, small town (8/23/2008 8:08:56 PM)

QLC, you asked if i was being cynical. yes i guess i was. a lot of the comments here make no common sense. just throwing in my no common sense comment. -- Hunters Revenge ID was annette. - and if that is really her picture she is a knock out.

okie ridgerunner, small town (8/23/2008 8:13:57 PM)

A lot of us disagree with each other. but what is nice we can all leave our comments right or wrong. and some comments are right for some and wrong for others. and some are just down right stupid at times. i am talking about my self right along with others.

Democrat, (8/24/2008 5:43:48 AM)

Neither the power of the state to regulate its militia, nor the right of the people of that well-regulated militia to keep and bear arms suitable for militia use is being violated by the federal government when state government authorities ask for certain gun owners to volunarily allow their guns to be tested in this case.

Also, the ninth amendment, which actually protects the right of law-abiding citizens to own handguns for the defense of lives in our homes, is not being violated by this exercise of lawful police-power. It seems that the most important point is to advance the investigation of a heinous crime commited against two innocent girls. May God rest their souls and give their families and friends peace and justice.

not a volunteer victim, Ft Myers (8/25/2008 8:41:07 PM)

Fred stated:
"A background check is not made, and nothing is recorded. It is all done in cash. The NRA wants it this way. I say pistol because you don't hunt with a pistol."

First, my wife and I have purchased a number of pistols, including her Glock, at local gun shows, and every purchase involved an NRA supported background check exactly as mandated by the NRA supported federal law. And second, yes we do hunt with a pistol.

Quit trying to spread the Brady propaganda.

,40 Glock, (8/26/2008 11:01:34 AM)

To yirmin snipe. Your comments that law enforcement would be able to tell if you changed firing pins and did what you could to change the rifliling marks are correct. However I do not know that I want to go into court and tell the jury that a certain person is guilty of murder because he did all this.
to Democrat, no one is saying the police/fbi are breaking the law. If you want to have your firearm tested that is your right. It is your right to let the police try and violate your rights to find a murderer. You know you always hear about cooperating with the police. First of all where did this statement come from? Somebody banging on my door and saying the police want this from you is not my idea of cooperation. The police have their definition. Here is mine. Two or more parties working together to a common goal. The goal: find the murder. That means when the police come to your door, just say "cooperate with me and show me the court order, and I will cooperate with you."Two parties working together. Now there may be some of you that will say if the police have a court order they will not need your cooperation. Well let me tell you a little story out in Chesapeake, Virginia that has not come to trial yet. There was a piece of garbage who wanted to mess with an individual. He tells the police this individual has a major drug operation going on in his home. The pathetic police do not to any investigation but simply go to the judge to get the warrant. They wait till late at night probably say "police", wait one second and start plowing through the door. The individual wakes up as they are plowing through the door and fires a shot through it, fearing for his life. Yep, you guessed it. One dead cop. Do you think this police officer would have liked to have had this individual's cooperation. One side note. They found one maijauna joint. A misdemeanor.