Norm_Fish, (10/13/2008 7:13:41 AM)

Most Central/South American countries do the same thing. Dia de la Raza is on the same day as 'Columbus day' but it’s more like 'Hispanic culture day'. I think this is a better use of a federal holiday.
I’ve never been fond of calling it Columbus day (at least at since the age where I learned exactly what 'discovering the new world' really entailed). So, I can go with it.
Happy Native American Day.

Eagle 4, Tulsa (10/13/2008 7:14:38 AM)

It is a laugher that Columbus is celebrated as discovering the "New World!"
I used to hunt Amerind artifacts along the lake shores before legislation made it virtually a crime and many types of the stone points have been dated to before 9,000 BC.
The Native Americans who first saw the laughable palefaces, with their funny clothes and hairy faces, too soon were dying by the millions from "Old World" diseases and barbarity.

lil sparrow, Tulsa (10/13/2008 7:40:38 AM)

Song of the day: Everybody hurts sometime. R.E.M.

Tony G, Tulsa (10/13/2008 7:41:54 AM)

All this happened over 150 years ago.
When are they Indians going to learn forgiveness?
With free health care--ability to open businesses that whites, blacks or orientals can't
I would think they would learn.
What I really want to say is--Why are the actions of the white mans ancestors still held
against the whites of today. We're mad because of what your great great great great grandfather did--seems petty to me, especially when you consider that almost every race has been abused at one time or another

Eagle 4, Tulsa (10/13/2008 8:07:24 AM)

Tony,
it's not a matter of forgiveness, it is a matter of remembrance. Just as some wish to commemorate "what happened over 150 years ago" with Columbus, others wish to remember their thousands of years of heritage and the near-annihilation of their people, an estimated 30 million in the Americas, which "officially" stopped around 1896.
And it is the abuse you speak of that we, people of any persuasion, seek to stop by such rememberance. What applies here is the saying, "Those who do not remember history are doomed to repeat it."

proud2be.ndn, indian country (10/13/2008 8:10:03 AM)

It would be the same for the Jewish people to celebrate "Hitler Day." Both Hitler and Columbus and the rest of the Europeans were the instigators of genocide of the Native Peoples.

Angry Citizen!, Bluejacket (10/13/2008 8:22:59 AM)

proud2be.ndn

Hitler? You need to brush up on your history just a bit, Custer really did die for our sins.

C.R. Delough, Tulsa (10/13/2008 8:31:02 AM)

Good job on laying down Godwin's law on the thread proud2be.ndn. Thanks for that.

Bluebird48, Sand Springs (10/13/2008 8:34:13 AM)

Happy Alexander the Great Day!
He hellenized/civilize the World or tried to clean up most of it. When his guys saw that some people gave more respect to cows and rats over newborn babies, whoa it was time to go home!!

Without that guy...all of you would still be living in caves!! Just think about it.

YAYTulsa, Catoosa, OK (10/13/2008 8:53:40 AM)

Hitler, Columbus, the rest of the Europeans, Indians, Africans (black and white)... I could go on. The truth is, People commit atrocities against other people. Until we get it into our heads that WE are all people and we do these things to ourselves, the problem remains.

Graychin, Eucha (10/13/2008 9:04:25 AM)

Columbus "discovered" America in 1492. I that in grade school. That's more that 150 years ago. That's more than 500 years ago! I learned some simple math in grade school, too.

The consequences of Columbus' "discovery" (America was already known to its existing inhabitants) were disastrous to native people. As much as 90% of the original population died from European diseases or outright murder. Some of the disastrous consequences to native people were unintended. Some were not.

Forgiveness? Forget about it? I don't think so. Native people have just as much to remember and mourn as the Jewish people have over their Holocaust. Only it happened longer ago.

You've seen the T-shirt with the picture of the armed Indians:

"Homeland Security - Protecting America Since 1492."

Bullhead, Stilwell (10/13/2008 9:37:54 AM)

Thank you, Graychin! I don't believe in crying a river for things that happened to us many moons ago however, I believe they should be remembered. And it's nice to know others realize just what our ancestors went through.

Endora, Real Cherokee Vote gets carried away sometimes. He has a hatred for Chad Smith that runs his life and he can't seem to get it out of his mind. He sleeps with it and wakes up with it. Forgive him.

YAYTulsa, Catoosa, OK (10/13/2008 9:50:04 AM)

"There they stole Red Stick canoes, which they used to transport a mixed force of Cherokee, Creek, and Tennessee Militia back to the peninsula. These men attacked the Red Sticks from the rear, burning the village of Tohopeka and taking the women and children prisoner." - George C. Mackenzie's account of The Battle of Horseshoe Bend

Nice protecting, thanks. See, people against people. In this case RED people against other RED people. These dead red people happen to be my ancestors according to family tradition, passed on grudgingly by a woman who would hide in her room and cry if you brought it up. Should I rally against the Cherokee? I'm a mutt, should I forgive myself, or not? Why don't we all sit together and learn what people are capable of doing to each other so we can also learn NOT to.

Ayo, T-Town (10/13/2008 12:53:52 PM)

America doesn't even admit to the genocide, attempted cultural genocide, and holacaust against the indegenous people of this continent. Much of it done by so called christians. And it is much more recent that the last 150 years.

I've always found it odd that people can and rightfully so, sympathize with the holocaust commited against the Jewish people by Hitler's regime, but won't admit to the holocaust commited against Native Americans. No one ever seems to say that the Jewish people are whining about that holocaust, yet if anyone else says anything about the atrocities which Americans did to Native Americans and Blacks here in the USA it whining. Go figure.

kyote, (10/13/2008 1:24:50 PM)

Columbus day and martin luther king day should neither be federal holidays. Combine them into an American Indian Day and make it a federal holiday.

Few Clothes, Austin, TX (10/13/2008 1:26:02 PM)

Who cares? The Indians are allowed to have their casinos and smokeshops without hiring whites. I really don't like the perks they are given. Now don't start the babble about how the white men spoke with forked tongues and took everything away from them. That was then, this is now.

Few Clothes, Austin, TX (10/13/2008 1:27:59 PM)

Graychin, nice photo of the first and best James Bond.

Few Clothes, Austin, TX (10/13/2008 1:30:06 PM)

Kyote. A grand idea you have combining the two holidays so both groups could whine and try to make us all guilty about what century old dead people might have done.

AzaD, (10/13/2008 1:47:29 PM)

Hey, Few Clothes - where do you think the "present" came from? Do you think it just popped into existence with no connection to anything that happened before it? It's a fact that the dawn of the white man (I am one) was the beginning of the end for the Indigenous Peoples of N. America. It's hard to forget things that happened and that were wrong - especially when NO ONE was ever punished, and NO ONE ever made any recompense for it in any way, whatsoever. I don't think getting to have casinos, hospitals and "sovereignty" really makes up for centuries of murder, oppression and what's generally known as "highway robbery," to be completely blunt.

But then again, to know all that, you'd have to know something about history, and most people on here don't know anything about it, obviously. RSU in Claremore still has class today, and I will be going. And no, Columbus did NOT discover America, he was some moron who at first thought he'd found India, despite the notable lack of Hindu temples in the Bahamas.

Few Clothes, Austin, TX (10/13/2008 2:29:28 PM)

AzaD. Scientists and historians have recently discovered that the first people to be here could have been Asian and Russians. I love how you scream at me with all caps. You would make a good bleeding heart here in Austin.

Zoomin-in, Tea Town (10/13/2008 2:36:00 PM)

I don't celebrate Columbus Day either. The idea that the "New World" was "discovered" is not logical.

thinker, (10/13/2008 2:39:40 PM)

and the Native Americans didn't discover it either.......

libdem, (10/13/2008 2:43:42 PM)

why don't we get rid of all holidays and do volunteer work on those ex-holidays
OBAMA 08-12-16-20

terriann, (10/13/2008 7:08:11 PM)

This article stated the state sanctioned this holiday for state employees. I am a state employee and I didn't have the day off like the federal employees. People believe state employees get a lot of holidays off but unlike teachers we get what private companies give their employees. The tulsa work should make a retraction about state workers being off on Columbus Day.

Billie08, (10/14/2008 10:40:02 AM)

Hey Few Clothes, have you looked in some of the smokeshops and casinos lately. If they are all Native Americans working in there then they could pass for white people. I've been in some of those places and in the Indian hospitals, over half of the people claim to be Native American but look white or black to me.