QLC, (7/8/2009 7:32:04 AM)

Someone is finally developing property, at their expense, that was generating virtually no taxes anyway. What a threat, Bill, the sky is falling!

I think the council's demands are going to fall on deaf ears when they have let the river languish for so many years.

paleface, Ponca City (7/7/2009 11:08:38 PM)

Shut up Mister Christiansen I for one am tired of your month and when you start getting on my indian people I will have some words for you so just zip it up...

Shooter, Tulsa (7/8/2009 8:53:23 AM)

The problem with this issue is that the City of Tulsa will be responsible for the water and infrastructure needs for the this development, but receive no tax revenues to maintain it. That doesnt really seem fair. I have nothing against these tribes trying to prosper but why should cities be responsible for water and infrastructure needs which is costly and then receive no financial benefit.

Shooter, Tulsa (7/8/2009 8:55:21 AM)

If they want to develop this area fine, however they should have to pay city taxes just like any other business would.

Shooter, Tulsa (7/8/2009 9:43:34 PM)

Arthur
I dont think anyone is upset about the Tribes wanting to build and create revenue for their tribe it is the fact that if they build it inside the city limits they city is still responsible for maintaining the infrastructure around the businesses and receive no money from those businesses, because of their "Tax Free" way of doing business. If one of their business catches on fire who are they going to call?? TFD. What if someone is robbing one of those businesses who do they want to respond??? TPD. I dont think it is unquestionable for the city that will provide water sewer, police and fire protection, and build up the streets around these business to pay a city tax!! No one is trying to deny the tribes to build up but they need to pay taxes for services renedered just like everyone else.

I dont think the way the indians were treated over 100 years ago was right, but I dont think what happened over 100 years ago should give tribes "carte blanche" to just demand city services and not have to pay for it at all. Let them build their business but they need to pay for services they receive just like anyone else would!!

Shooter, Tulsa (7/14/2009 1:52:23 PM)

DJ's I unaware that the native americans bought and paid for this land. They were living here but it is the "Evil White Man" who has brought jobs, and industry and the ability to live the way we do instead of in Teepees wearing a buffalo skin in the winter. So before you start spouting off your nonsense remember we all live here now and if the indian decendants want to build businesses they should be subject to the same rules as everyone else is end of subject!!!

Scott Smith, Tulsa (7/8/2009 10:18:50 AM)

Hopefully he's just trying to get a precedent set so when it's time to fight the bridge they have something to go on.

Graybeard, Tulsa (7/7/2009 8:01:28 PM)

I'm in complete agreement with B.C. on this one. The banks of the Arkansas River is going to look like Las Vegas one of these days if a solution isn't found.
We need less casino activity in the State of Oklahoma and Tulsa.

Mar, Tulsa (7/8/2009 11:36:41 AM)

I agree with Bill Christianson. The way things keep going we just as well hand over the city of Tulsa to BA, Bixby, Jenks, Owasso and let them take over along with the Indian Tribes.

Enough is enough. The Indian Tribes have enough land for their casinos, smoke shops, etc. Tulsa needs to protect it's own land, develop how it sees fit where the city benefits from the taxes and use of their land.

I was hoping Bill Christianson would run for mayor, as he would have had my vote.

Mar, Tulsa (7/8/2009 11:41:34 AM)

Hey paleface, you be quiet. You are in Ponca City, not Tulsa, so it is none of your business.

I agree with Shooter.

scouter, Tulsa (7/8/2009 8:47:01 AM)

Sovereignty? OK. Set up a customs border crossing at the property line. Require a passport to pass either way. Also allow them to provide all their utility services themselves for their own country.

irwindale, Tulsa (7/8/2009 8:15:09 AM)

What is the problem! We gave Ruth Kaiser and her group of Nut lovers exemptions at Yale and 244. The American indians were here first anyway.

T!ger,, Tulsa (7/8/2009 10:22:31 PM)

Well, that isn't fair at all! It is fine if they want to develop the area and all, but they should have to pay city taxes like every other business and citizen of Tulsa.

Eagle 4, Tulsa (7/8/2009 7:08:12 AM)

Hey, if Peter comes up short just ask Paul, er, Ken Yazel to increase property taxes, er, assessments again, like he did to me this year. Thanks, Ken, I really appreciate that on a fixed income.

I have a resolution that BC - how fitting - will never see my vote in his column.

Ric, Broken Arrow (7/8/2009 8:19:43 AM)

The way I see it is that Tulsa County voted against spending taxpayer money on the river. The River Tax was voted NO...
Now, if someone wants to privately build on the river, it's up to them.

flub-a-dub, (7/8/2009 6:46:39 AM)

As I recall, neither Mayor Bill Lafortune nor any of the Tulsa City Councilors (Bill Christiansen!) bothered to attend as invited guests for the groundbreaking of a $200 million casino at 81st and Riverside a few years back. Now the City can't understand why the Creek Nation won't cooperate with their Insistence. Is isn't time the City of Tulsa started treating it's neighbors with due respect? And now the City Council wants to pass a resolution on the issue without sitting down with the Creek Nation to find resolution first. More examples of great leadership?

flub-a-dub, (7/8/2009 6:56:55 AM)

Bill Christiansen finds it "scary to think". More importantly he is attempting to create fear in the hearts of Tulsa citizens over a parking lot on the east side of the river and flood land on the west. How in the world is the tribalization of such parcels going to "drain" the City's financial resoures? When's the next election. I want new leadership!

flub-a-dub, (7/8/2009 7:25:20 AM)

I find it comical that in recent years our City Council stood idlely by while Sapulpa annexed the Townwest area and our City Council refused to act on annexing the Northwest Passage area and yet they are overly concerned about tribalization of private property because it will have negative impact on tax revenue. And now the City of Tulsa wants to develop the Arkansas riverbank in partnership with the Creek Nation. My daddy would say to that, "why would I want to marry her when I can't get along with her in the first place". Until the City of Tulsa can treat it's neighbors with civility it can temporarily forget about partnerships.

Arthur, (7/8/2009 12:56:42 PM)

The matter of the City of Tulsa opposing the business activities of the Creeks and the Cherokees really needs to stop. It is worse than kicking a gift horse in the teeth. Instead of these unfounded and truly false claims of City revenue losses due to tribal land ownership and trust status, the City ought to be trying to structure “compacts” with the tribes that establish a long-term developmental relationship that can only benefit every citizen and taxpayer in the City of Tulsa.

Today’s news also noted that the State of Oklahoma received $105 million in revenues from Native American casinos. That money benefits every Oklahoman in some way.

I don’t know where, when or how such opposition to development by tribal authorities originated in Tulsa city government, but it is flat out embarrassing.

And aren’t we witnessing Councilor Christiansen setting the table to again fight against the new south Tulsa bridge and the other enterprises that the Creek Nation is proposing inside the Tulsa city limits for the area of 121st and Yale? You bet we are, despite the increase in property values, the salaries of scores of workers, and increased sales tax revenues formal studies have shown that opening the bridge will create on non-tribal lands inside Tulsa.

Tulsa, led by Mayor Taylor and many city councilors, has created a new meaning for “NIMBY”: No Indians In My Backyard. What a great way to polish the city’s economic development image and opportunities.

It’s all just sickening. May God help Tulsa to somehow, someway change NIMBY to mean “No Imbeciles In My Backyard!”

peelumba, (7/8/2009 6:10:21 AM)

just charge them 10 times the rates for water and sewer along with any other service necessary for any development they would need for infastructure.

Thunder196, Tulsa (7/7/2009 7:39:14 PM)

I can remember several years back when the Bingo Halls and their Pull Tabs were under attack. Look where we are now. I understand what Bill Christiansen is saying, but I haven't seen Indian Tribes lose very many battles over issues like this.

Thunder196, Tulsa (7/7/2009 9:48:45 PM)

Are they going to tell everyone who wants to buy that land, what they can or can't do with it. Or are they just going to tell the tribes wanting to increase their holdings what they can or can't do with it. I think they are going to get into federal laws on this one. Though I could be wrong. It seems this city loves to spend money on attorney fees over stuff like this.

bearway, Jenks (7/7/2009 7:45:41 PM)

If they buy land, it's theirs. They are a Sovereign Nation and will do with their holdings as they wish.

I think the City of Tulsa should control spending on non-essentials like the rest of us have.

olddude, tulsa (7/8/2009 8:13:29 AM)

It is there land,that we stole from them.give it back,at least that can build something that will make a profit.

DowntownNow, (7/8/2009 8:17:34 AM)

Christiansen is unfortunately painting himself the fool with this matter. He is taking a side to trounce established federally protected tribal prpocurement practices on established tribal lands and at the same time yelling that it will dimish the City of Tulsa's tax revenue.

Someone needs to provide a wake-up call to Christiansen and the rest of the Counil...until they start wanting to work with developers and incentivize them to develop more, no one will and the lands in question will continue to sit and rot with no tax revenue generation.

If the tribe comes in and develops these areas under trust, the surrounding property then becomes more valuable and enticing to develop, thereby giving the City of Tulsa greater sales and property tax revenue than what its seeing today. Christiansen,our current adminstration and the Council are proving to be shortsighted when it comes to Tulsa's growth potential.

Imagine the sales tax revenues if the City was willing to part with City owned lands, free of charge but for appropriate and approved mixed use developments that would generate sales and property taxes. Far less investment than a BOK Center and ballpark with a far greater amount of return on it.