jam, tulsa (11/21/2007 5:44:03 AM)

If your company can't compete fairly with other law abiding companies, without hiring illegals, your company shouldn't be in business. In other words...hire illegals at your own risk.

The Oracle, Tulsa (11/21/2007 5:50:33 AM)

The LEGAL Hispanic community feels threatened by the ILLEGAL Hispanic community.It is the responsibility of employers to verify immigration status.Let us all encourage roadblocks and traffic checkpoints to check for legal drivers liscenses,and legal insurance verification,and outstanding warrants.

Tony G., (11/21/2007 6:39:59 AM)

I own a small business, and we have NEVER

used illegals, don't plan on it either.

But, I can sympathize with some of these contractors, finding GOOD American workers can be difficult. Two years ago, I tried 5 different Americans, all were dumber than a box of rocks

pd, (11/21/2007 7:27:21 AM)

It is true there is a lot of confusion among small business owners about how this law will affect them. Employers want to do things right, but are not federal immigration officers. They are also concerned about the liability for discrimination created by the law. The answer is, nobody knows how this will shake out. The law will likely be struck down, but it's hard for employers to decide whether to comply in the mean time.

Bruce, (11/21/2007 7:56:09 AM)

Everyone says it is the Federal Governments role to check immigrants rights to work in America, what. The role has to be done at the employers

arby, (11/21/2007 8:09:52 AM)

We must halt illegal immigration by fighting it on all fronts.

Businesses offering jobs to illegals are enabling them to live in the US "under the radar". A few more steps to check the credentials of prospective employees is a small price to pay to stop the invasion of the illegals.

Doug, (11/21/2007 8:42:37 AM)

It's going to be tough on business owners to inforce these new laws but it's the ONLY way to rid us of these people. It is now a felony to hire and harbor illigals so it is extremely important that every company that hires manual labors checks the legitimacy of their worker's documentation in order to stay out of the courts. I for one am so glad that this state has taken the initiative to force illigals out of the state. I truely believe that other states are watching this very closely and soon they will adopt laws like HB 1804.

JW, (11/21/2007 11:22:26 AM)

sounds like these guys were getting together to find out how to use loopholes to keep their butts out of the sling. If you aren't breaking the law there there is nothing to complain about.

rufus, jackson (11/21/2007 1:09:25 PM)

It is no harder to check legal status than it is for any other part of usual business. Employer's being caught employing illegals will lose all government contracts and licenses to work in this state..

Angelena, Tulsa (11/21/2007 2:23:44 PM)

This section of the bill is fabulous. The only reason why these contractors hire illegal immigrants is because they will work for a cheaper salary. This is crazy, if you hire an illegal over a U.S. citizen you deserve a discrimination law suit to slap you in the face. I am just glad this state has come to realize that the ones getting dicriminated against is the citizens of the U.S.A.

rose, Tulsa (11/21/2007 3:25:24 PM)

Gimme a break - a large percentage of the illegal workers contractors have been employing don't even speak English. How can they claim they have no idea they might be illegal?

I do agree that if existing law was enforced at the federal level, Oklahoma and other states wouldn't need to pass bills like 1804.

If an employer lets a legal worker go to replace them with an illegal worker - he should be subject to a lawsuit and violation of several other laws.

It's time to begin paying a fair wage for a days work again and employ legal workers.

If the illegal workers do what's necessary to become legal, they will also benefit by earning a better wage.

These business owners earned a living Before the invasion of illegal workers so they just need to return to the percentage they kept then.

I expect to see many other states pass similar bills. Hooray Oklahoma!

Dan, BA (11/21/2007 11:47:34 PM)

I am always amazed at how the "open border" folks (including the Tulsa Worker) are always crying in their beer because somebody might have to follow the law. It's the law!!

Again, it's the law! Hire illegal aliens at your own peril. I, for one will willingly turn your butt in if you ignore it.

Brian C, Scottsdale (11/21/2007 11:51:45 PM)

The sooner the illegals are out of the equasion, the sooner all of the contractors will be bidding on a level playing field. I don't know about Oklahoma, but here in The Phoenix area, it is necessary to bid Painting jobs (I am a painting contractor) at 10 year old rates and I am still underbid. Illegals that are willing to steal identities are also willing to use other peoples contractor's numbers and lie about insurance etc. It's going to be a little rough during the correction, but I know that I will be making more money the sooner the illegal competition is gone. I won't hire illegals. I just can't contribute to a problem that is costing the U.S. taxpayers $200 to $230 BILLION DOLLARS each year. Further, the legal hispanics better get on the righ side of this problem or more contractors will stop hiring any of them because they aren't worth the hassle. I have. I do less work. I have less problems. I make more net proffit.

dr morris, bartlesville (11/22/2007 1:01:23 AM)

If every one would hire only people that are born in the united states there would not be any problems. A house built by illegals should sell for alot less because of the poor workmanship,i myself would not buy anything that a illegal has built.........

rose, Tulsa (11/22/2007 6:07:16 AM)

Enforcement of the law will only improve the atmosphere for honest employers.

As Brian from Scottsdale explained, many who employ illegal workers keep the honest employers who pay a fair wage from getting the jobs.

My brother works in construction and has told me of many contractors who are now replacing illegal workers with legal ones. The man my brother works for has never hired illegal workers, but having ethics puts him in the minority.

I have to disagree with Dr Morris' statement about workmanship though.

When our roof was replaced several years ago, we hired a reputable local company that had been around for a long time. As an end customer, you don't interview the staff who will be doing the work. I was surprised when the crew consisted of only workers who did not speak English. The crew leader was the only person on the job who spoke English. However, they did do a great job and completed the job quickly without problems.

Despite the good results, I couldn't help thinking of the 4 or 5 legal families that once lived and paid their bills from the work being done by people who were obviously here illegally.

If someone is here illegally and cannot speak English, they are also breaking additional laws to survive. If an employer requires an SSN, they are either providing false or stolen information. If they drive, they are probably driving without a license or insurance. Anyone who lives in east Tulsa can tell you that while one family may rent a home, it's obvious that more than one family ends up living there and the vehicles overlfow the parking areas of the homes.

Of course they spend money while living here, but in many instances, a portion of their earnings leaves the country.

If those same jobs were still held by legal workers, their wage would be higher and all of the income would remain here. The legal families would prosper instead of having to find other methods of providing for their families.

Most of the illegals are hard working and try to stay out of trouble, but they are illegal and unethical employers (sadly, most of them) have taken advantage of the cheaper labor. While it's helped line the pockets of the employers, it's been devastating to the legal workers who have been displaced.

As others have pointed out, the impact of so many illegals reaches far beyond the jobs. The cost of all the services that have been provided to illegals - beginning with bilingual education in public schools. The healthcare expenses for a huge group of people without healthcare insurance. The cost of bodily and property damage from a huge group of people who drive without insurance. The reduction of property values when too many homes in an area are occupied by way too many people with cars all over the place. The affect on some business areas where hand painted signs in Spanish are all you see. The list goes on and on and on.

Whether the individuals here illegally are good people or not, is not the issue. They are here illegally and the negative impact on our society is huge and far-reaching. They need to get legal or go home.

The unscrupulous businesses that have taken advantage of the situation for years now need to obey the law or pay the consequences.

I too would turn in anyone who continues to violate the law. It hurts all of us.

JON DILDINE , GLENPOOL (11/22/2007 5:33:17 PM)

YOU FOLKS SCREAMING ABOUT THE "ILLEGAL MEXICANS, WHAT ABOUT THOSE FROM CHINA AND OTHER PARTS OF THE WORLD?.

WHEN ALL THE 'ILLEGALS" ARE DEPORTED OR JAILED,( EXAMPLE) YOU WILL PAY $6,000.00 FOR A NEW ROOF PUT 0N BY LAZY AMERICANS DEMANDING $100,00 A SQ.INSTEAD OF PAYING $2500.00 PUT ON BY "ILLEGALS" AT $42.OO A SQ. DOES GETTING RID OF "ILLEGALS" REALLY MAKE SINSE?

Tom, Tulsa (11/22/2007 7:56:37 PM)

#16-Jon: You "BETCHA" it makes sence to get rid of the illegals!!! Who said anything about just illegal Mexicans. H.B. 1804 refers to ALL illegals, not just Mexicans. Why are you screaming so loudly about this anyway? Oh, I know, you are one that hires illegals !!!

rose, Tulsa (11/23/2007 6:37:49 AM)

to Jon - post# 16:

DUH - we paid over $4000 several years ago and the crew consisted of illegal workers. Most employers are just pocketing a larger share, the savings is not being passed on to the customer by most companies.

Even if it were, legal citizens earning a livable wage benefits every sector of our society. They have a bit of income left to spend locally after necessities. They can provide for the needs of their families and not depend on social benefit programs to keep them alive.

Even if the workers weren't here illegally, too many employers have been guilty of discrimination in hiring. The practice of hiring only illegals breaks several laws.

Get legal or go somewhere else!

MAC, Tulsa/San Diego (11/23/2007 1:17:14 PM)

For all you law breakers out there you can quit using that lame, borrowed theme that it's the Federal Govts job. Even if the Fed are or are not enforcing it you still have to comply. That's like saying it's ok to cheat on your taxes until you get caught. YOU KNOW IT'S ILLEGAL so stop it.

Esperanza, Guymon - USA (11/25/2007 1:32:31 PM)

How quickly we forget who we are. Isn't Oklahoma the home of the "Sooners" and the genisis setting of the "Grapes of Wrath"?

Things that make you go, "Hmmm!"

Gary, Oklahoma City (11/27/2007 8:30:28 PM)

The only firms that have anything to be "wary" of are those hiring illegal immigrants. It is obvious which firms these are, as they are the companies complaining about half their staff leaving the state. Frankly, I applaud this. The self-enforced mass exodus has saved the Oklahoma taxpayer untold millions of dollars in enforcement costs and those employers who have lost employees as a result of this voluntary exodus have, whether they appreciate it or not, been spared millions in fines and possible prison time for violating the law.