buddy, tulsa (11/28/2007 1:11:35 AM)

"Significant changes in the school's board of regents may also be warranted, he said."

Rock on Mr. Green

CA GRAD, (11/28/2007 1:26:33 AM)

I am truly speechless regarding the press coverage and the current situation at ORU. I have always taken great pride that I graduated from Oral Roberts and will continue to take great joy in my decision to attend an university that has always been devoted to advancing the gospel, educating the whole man as well as healing the broken hearted. Regardless of what people think Chancellor Roberts and Former President Richard Roberts' decision to relinquish their authority should be recognize. On another note, I wish the my former professors well in their new endeavors regardless of what the outcome of the lawsuit.

Fifty Dollar Fine, (11/28/2007 1:38:22 AM)

From the article (Ziva, girl, you are on fire tonight): " Splitting up: Separating ORU and the evangelical association "was actually an agreement many years ago with the IRS and over time they have blended together," Pearsons said.

Although the two are separate nonprofit entities, 14 of the 15 key officers and trustees of the evangelical association are also listed as key officers and trustees of ORU.

The ministry spent most of its $12 million in revenue last fiscal year on its weekly television shows, direct mail and other outreach efforts.

Separating the two won't be simple, Pearsons said.

"There's a lot of overlap that takes place, and so we just have to sit down, go through that and make sure the proper separation is there," he said.

.

Let's see how long they tie themselves up in litigation to keep them "overlapped" for as long as possible.

Skeptical at Best, Troy (11/28/2007 1:38:51 AM)

From the New York Times, the REAL story:

Mr. Pearsons said that because of pending litigation, the regents would not disclose the results of an outside investigation into accusations presented to the board.

Alumnus, Tulsa (11/28/2007 1:43:37 AM)

Thank you Mr. Green !

You have saved ORU ! I hope you follow your investment in ORU thoughout the years. Please

assure us that the university will "get its act together". So many rely on the future of ORU!

Another alumnus, (11/28/2007 1:53:22 AM)

There is still so much to do at ORU, but there is a light at the end of the tunnel. And no, it's not the headlight of an oncoming train. ORU has a real chance to be an excellent university. All of us wh love ORU are happy about that, and somehow, I hope that people who haven't been that crazy about ORU might be willing to reconsider the school's value as real changes are made.

The J-Man, Hopeful, Somewhere East of Tulsa, (11/28/2007 1:57:19 AM)

Oh, I can see it now ... The Oral Roberts University signs will come down and the Hobby Lobby University signs will go up!

OK, so probably not. Please forgive my attempt at humor here. :-)

Anyway, I am glad to see the Roberts' willingly step down. Regardless of the good they have done, they have tainted the reputation of the University by creating the atmosphere in which the allegations that have been made can proliferate.

I look at this fresh infusion of cash and competent oversight as a sign from God that the University will survive and continue to educate our young people for many, many years to come.

A lot of prayers are being answered!

Skeptical at best, Troy (11/28/2007 2:00:51 AM)

320. 11/28/2007 1:55:38 AM, Skeptical at best, Troy

Quote: Mark Green said that public trust and confidence was the most important thing-RESTORING THE PUBLIC TRUST IS ORU'S GREATEST PROBLEM.

He went on to say the Green family DOES NOT see ORU's issue as a financial problem-its a matter of public trust in ORU and ORM that can only be resloved by full financial transparency.

Why should ANYONE have confidence in hucksters, who blow thousands on golf, clothes and shopping trips to Chicos, all while the faculty and staff NEVER receive raises, and don't have money for copies or basic office supplies???

Also, I notice ORU's former accountant is suing them. Please note, the BOR doesn't control that, and the results of that can't be covered up, like the results of the investigation into financial wrongdoings by the Robertses.

John, Raleigh, NC (11/28/2007 2:01:11 AM)

Green is a good guy. He has been active in other ministries including Liberty University.

Now, if ORU will get rid of several "suspect" BOR members they will establish MUCH more credibility. Not good when three of them are under investigation. I hope that happens and the school prospers.

qqq, (11/28/2007 2:05:50 AM)

I don't like to say this, but what they are saying about separation of OREA and ORU is suspiciously close to the current state of affairs. This is one place where they describe the current state of affairs:

.

"The Board of Regents has sole and complete authority over all of the business, secular, corporeal, commercial, financial, pecuniary, fiscal, and other non-spiritual affairs of the Corporation."

.

That key word, "non-spiritual", seems to have covered up a hole big enough to drive this whole mess through, namely that the "Lifetime Spiritual Regents" could veto ANY action of the BOR, and could only be overridden by a 90% vote of the Regents. This is based on what Dr. Don Vance said on KFAQ a few days ago reporting what the tenured faculty were told by Oral at their meeting early last week.

.

So what is going to be different now?

.

If the key word is TRUST, the BOR must freely make available the current Bylaws and Articles of Incorporation of ORU. As I understand the law, this is required by the IRS anyway for 501(C)(3) non-profits, so it should not be a hardship. The BOR must then indicate how these have been changed to cause a separation of ORU and OREA.

.

A separate item, of course, is the reduction in the large number of common members on the OREA Board and the ORU BOR.

.

I understand that many want assurances that ORU will not drift in a secular direction. I am only asking that the BOR make completely clear to everyone what they are doing at this juncture to separate OREA and ORU that is different from the past. What George Pearsons says is, "However, the spiritual connection between the two organizations will remain." What EXACTLY is that connection. If the BOR wants TRUST, vague words are not sufficient.

Skeptical at best, Troy (11/28/2007 2:07:41 AM)

Alumni, students, faculty and staff and also plaintiff's in the action that brought about all this should sue the Board of Regents to obtain and disclose publicly, the results of the independent investigation into financial wrongdoing by the Robertses. They have no legal right to cover this up as Pearsons is doing , they are doing it to orchestrate coverage of this situation.

curious, Fort Myers,FL (11/28/2007 2:17:41 AM)

Will the investigation continue with ORM? If the Robert's misused ORU monies, isn't the same true for ORM?

If they are to be separate, I would think the ORM would be moved to a totally new location away from the ORU campus.

Will be interesting to see if and how the lawsuits with the Robert's go from here.

Mark, Grand Prairie (11/28/2007 2:19:56 AM)

The ORU community is extremely thankful today. Thankful for the grace extended by Mr. Green. Thankful for the courage of the Board of Regents in doing the right thing, prior to any involvement by Mr. Green. We are extremely grateful and proud of the tenured faculty for their courage and faithful service. We are also thankful for Richard Roberts' service to the University and his willingness to step down, and also for our founder Oral Roberts. This is just the first step in the healing process for the University. The shaking of the recent events, though difficult, will have the effect of solidifying the call and purpose of ORU. Thank you Mr. Green, and thank you, Lord. ~an ORU fan and alum.

Fifty Dollar Fine, (11/28/2007 2:28:51 AM)

#10 qqq - "That key word, "non-spiritual", seems to have covered up a hole big enough to drive this whole mess through, namely that the "Lifetime Spiritual Regents" could veto ANY action of the BOR, and could only be overridden by a 90% vote of the Regents. This is based on what Dr. Don Vance said on KFAQ a few days ago reporting what the tenured faculty were told by Oral at their meeting early last week.

.

So what is going to be different now?"

.

These ring shouts of praise the lords and hallelujah's and "rejoicing" (if I had a nickel for every time somebody wrote that word today on the TW...) about Big Pimp Daddy Green are misplaced and premature. I keep asking, "what the devil is a 'spiritual regent'".

.

What makes them so much more important than what, a non-spiritual regent?

.

And I'm still intrigued by this little bit from Pearsons: "Separating ORU and the evangelical association "was actually an agreement many years ago with the IRS and over time they have blended together,"

.

So, something fell through the cracks...and somebody left it lying there, apparently.

Fifty Dollar Fine, (11/28/2007 2:31:55 AM)

From the article:

.

"

"However, the spiritual connection between the two organizations will remain."

.

What the sam hill is that supposed to mean? Can someone please explain?

ORU Alumnus, Class of 91' (11/28/2007 2:33:19 AM)

Oral and Richard do not appear to be messing with the board in any way at this point.

Contrary to the often expressed view point of Richard laying dark clandestine plans to resume his throne somehow-

I think he is sitting at home hilariously happy he doesn't have to deal with 60 million in debt and all of ORU's week in and week out financial worries anymore.

I understand there is a large segment of the public out there that hates and loathes TV evangelist for various reasons.

However, ORU is not a TV ministry its a UNIVERSITY.

If you hate televangelist, then fine that is another issue.

No decent person of any kind would want ORU to go under and the university to close up.

I don't understand why people that are not alumni, have no connection to ORU, have never even been to Tulsa most likely even and have never given any money are ranting on against ORU.

You guys didn't like Richard because he asked for money over TV and used part of it to live lavishly-fine.

He and Lindsay are out now and responsible people are going over the books.

So, why don't you write out a check now and support the students and professors?

Do you want to see the American Red Cross destroyed because you don't like somebody on the board?

Ask yourself-

Do you hate ORU just because its a Christian school?

If you are leaping for joy because a conservative christian school is having problems- you have a much bigger problem in life than anything going on in Tulsa.

Go find something else to hate and watch for a downfall-may I recommend a politician or athlete.

Carl R, (11/28/2007 2:46:38 AM)

A VERY GOOD START

The iron grip of the imperial, royal family at last been broken.

In the nick of time.

Ant not to any of their credit.

NOTHING could be done until it was.

And it's been done without pulling down the temple walls.

A NEW DAY

That paves the way for money, new leadership, new policies, rationality to prevail.

PAY FAIRLY AND FIX DORMS

Now, maybe the profs and staff can be paid a decent wage and not have to buy their own copy paper so Lindsey's costly whims can be catered to, and the dorms fixed..

AN AWKWARD INTERREGNUM

But the separation has barely started.

The interregnum will be awkward -- and perilous. Some will not want change.

THE OLD GUARD

Key RR enablers such as Ellsworth have to be moved back -- and away from key decisions. They are tainted by complicity in RR's excesses.

RELEASE THAT REPORT WHEN THE LEGAL CASES ARE SETTLED

Pearsons said the reports could not be released pending litigation.

So alumni and other stakeholders should demand they be released once the litigation is settled?

Ignoring the past-- burying the past-- will not fee ORU for a clean start.

When the time comes, let us know what's in those reports.

To know history is to avoid repeating it.

This demand should be made and Pearsons should publicly commit to it.--ASAP

BOARD OF REGENTS

This BOR has been disfuctional. Only God knows what would have happened if Green had not heard the call.

It needs to be reduced in size -- and functional.

LEGAL CASES

They should be resolved fairly, the professors returned -- and those who filed them recognized and credited for starting this entire cleaning chain-of-events.

Agree or not, their actions woke everyone up and led to this.

TULSA WORLD

Ziva, April and management deserve the thanks of everyone. Mr. Green said he did not know of these events first hand, but by reading about them.

The comment boards have played a key role in all this. Agree or not agree, open free speech and the power of public opinion has played a very positive role

TO BE AWARE OF

The separation of the co-joined twins must be complete. At this point they share much -- kidneys, arteries, organs, so to speak.

There can be no compromise in the separation. If not total and complete, cancerous cells may be left in ORU, and come back to haunt it.

God bless the positive forces at ORU and give it a wonderful future.

-- that's how I see it.

stinky, norman (11/28/2007 2:57:35 AM)

only in oklahoma would this happen!

only in oklahoma would this happen!

only in oklahoma would this happen!

only in oklahoma would this happen!

only in oklahoma would this happen!

only in oklahoma would this happen!

only in oklahoma would this happen!

only in oklahoma would this happen!

-------

I'm sure glad Hobby Lobby University is located in south Tulsa!!!!

god, please get me out of this wretched state!

Carl R, (11/28/2007 3:03:36 AM)

Class of 91

You said, I don't understand why...

No you don't.

Equating criticism and pointing out areas that need fixing --which now even the BOR acknowledges to have been correct-- is not "hating" ORU.

You're way off-base.

Everyone in the Bodyof Christ has a stake i this.

Our own churches are affected by the terrible excesses tolerated at ORU for years.

People who know we are CHristian scoff when they read the dirty antics of so-called Christian leaders.

Have you never read that when one part of the body suffers, it all suffers.

So get off your elitist high - horse and realize it's not just your end of the boat sinking in this disgraceful episode, but our end, too.

And don't think in terms of hate, unless you're a hater familiar with the term.

How about lowering the temper, dropping the judgmental, pejorative terms and join all those who pointed out wrongs who are thankful that they may now be addressed?

It;s a time to help heal before the touch work of separation begins.

. How about you doing you part?

The same goes for you, too!, Truth (11/28/2007 4:04:33 AM)

How about lowering the temper, dropping the judgmental, pejorative terms and join all those who pointed out wrongs who are thankful that they may now be addressed?

It's a time to help heal before the touch work of separation begins.

The same goes for you, too. You've hurt many people through this process. You've got a lot to answer for.

just speculating, (11/28/2007 4:15:24 AM)

Note to OREA and ORM: A tangible sign of true separation between the ministry and ORU, would be for the ministry to move to an off-campus location. The former ORM building at 18th and Boulder is sitting vacant and in dire need of some TLC. Go back to your roots, Oral, and do something about this old eyesore sitting at the edge of downtown Tulsa. You built it, so fix it up and move back in.

Carl R, (11/28/2007 4:28:33 AM)

(apologizes for the repeat -- to clean 3 Am typos )

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

VERY GOOD START

The iron grip of the imperial, royal family at last been broken.

In the nick of time.

And not to any of their credit.

NOTHING could be done until it was.

And it's been done without pulling down the temple walls.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A NEW DAY

That paves the way for money, new leadership, new policies, rationality to prevail.

PAY FAIRLY AND FIX DORMS

Now, maybe the profs and staff can be paid a decent wage and not have to buy their own copy paper so Lindsey's costly whims can be catered to, and the dorms fixed..

-

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

AN AWKWARD INTERREGNUM

But the separation has barely started.

The interregnum will be awkward -- and perilous. Some will not want change.

THE OLD GUARD

Key RR enablers such as Ellsworth have to be moved back -- and away from key decisions. They are tainted by complicity in RR's excesses.

Obstructionists should not be tolerated.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

COMMIT NOW RELEASE THAT REPORT WHEN THE LEGAL CASES ARE SETTLED

Pearsons said the reports could not be released due to pending litigation.

Alumni and other stakeholders should demand they be released once the

litigation is settled. – and Pearsons should commit to it now.

The days of cover-up are over Mr. Pearsons.

Commit to releasing that report as soon as the reason you gave for not doing so

–the legal cases --- are cleared up.

Not doing so will taint the new incoming adminIstration and be seen as more of

the same—old secrecy.

Confirm that it is a new day – by making that commitment NOW..

To know history is to avoid repeating it -- and it will be instructive to other ministries to avoid.

The alumni should make the demand and insist it to done.

The past will not be put behind until it is released.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

BOARD OF REGENTS

This BOR has been dYsfuctional. Only God knows what would have happened if Green had not heard the call.

It needs to be reduced in size -- and functional, with no vote or veto power by any of the Robertses.

That needs to be made clear.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------.

LEGAL CASES

They should be resolved fairly, the professors returned all who filed them recognized and credited for starting this entire cleaning chain-of-events.

Agree or not, their actions woke everyone up and led to this.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

TULSA WORLD

Ziva, April and management deserve the thanks of everyone. Mr. Green said he did not know of these events first hand, but by reading about them.

The comment boards have played a key role in all this. Agree or not agree, open free speech and the power of public opinion has played a very positive role.

( Even if post 20 above

doesn't llike it

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

TO BE AWARE OF

The separation of the co-joined bodies must be complete.

At this point they share much -- kidneys, arteries, organs, so to speak.

There can be no compromise in the separation.

If not total and complete, cancerous cells may be left in ORU, and come back to haunt it.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Swails, Brooker and ORU-out, Say it ain't so (11/28/2007 4:36:16 AM)

Swails, Brooker and ORU-out (forver linked together) got what they wanted. But they never thought this would happen.

-------------------------------

All your fans are saying,

"So it ain't so, say it ain't so.

For Carl R, Real Apology needed (11/28/2007 4:42:47 AM)

Real apology needed, please. All the rest is a cover-up.

Comment, (11/28/2007 4:51:49 AM)

I can tell you one thing for sure. Green better bring in his own investigation team because anything short of that, the Roberts will still be in control. I would NOT trust a Roberts for anything, ever again. Green sounds like a true business man so I trust he has in own hired guns in there right now, overseeing all of the integrity of these records. I'm certain there's alot of loyal staff of the king and his family so I'd not trust any of them at all.