Four Sixteen Rigby, (7/18/2009 3:19:20 PM)

This is just about the saddest case I've ever seen. Normally, I'm pretty cynical about most things that are in the news, but this one is different.

Bullhead, Nicut (7/18/2009 3:26:27 PM)

Rigby, You are right in your feelings. This young woman suffered at the hands of these men.. suffered horribly before they murdered her. God rest her soul.

tnt091605, (7/18/2009 3:27:24 PM)

I feel so sorry for any parent that looses a child. I cannot imagine the pain they must feel. I am sure it is hard for her mother to understand that her daughter died at the hands of the evil that she went there to embrace.

Ayo, T-Town (7/18/2009 3:35:54 PM)

This is sad, and it's good that the killers are being prosecuted.

I wonder though...if her mother tried to explain to her, or stop her from going when the daughter asked her to make her a KKK robe. Odd, isn't it?

human1, Path to Change OK (7/18/2009 4:30:32 PM)

This is so sad. As long as people continue to make racist remarks and attempt to stereotype people based on race or being different the KKK will live on! Louisiana's past senator Daved Duke was the Grand Wizard of the KKK. I wonder what he had to say about this! There are 18 hate groups in Oklahoma.

""We are a patriot organization promoting Christian Ideas and seek people who display loyalty to and dedication for our children""
This is one of the self descriptions by the KKK online. Unfortuneatly it does not sound to much different from what some of Oklahoma's polititians might say here in the Bible Belt.

Why shouln't a young naive person think they are anything but some religious organization.

Many of the young have never lived through a Churh Bombing killing children, or seen the pictures of black women and children lynched
and hanging from trees. They can read derogatory comments on this site daily about people of a different race.

Condolences to the family.

Fred, Tulsa (7/18/2009 4:52:14 PM)

It is so sad and my heart goes out to the Mom for this sense-less loss. When Mom heard about the robe for the KKK that RED FLAG should have been enough. Yup, Shoulda Woulda,Coulda.

tao4mind, Enid (7/18/2009 5:13:02 PM)

The Sons of Dixie Knights of the Ku Klux Klan had 8 active members, the group had fewer than 20 current and former members all combined, all a collection of losers. The group's recruiting was done on the internet and never openly protested issues because of fear of being beat up. The characteristics of these men who shot an unarmed woman in her back is pitiful. The grass eternally looks greener on the other side of the fence, until you get there and find a group of losers. The Klan reorganized in 1937 and have been Yale men and Bonesmen for generations. Skull and Bones begins in December of 1832. Klan was founded in 1865, the second Klan was a formal fraternal organization, with a national and state structure. At its peak in the mid-1920s, the organization included about 15% of the nation's eligible population, approximately 4–5 million men. People should study history, Internal divisions and external opposition brought about mergers and acquisitions into the secret society at Yale, so if you want to be a Klan member in todays society you have to go to collage. They just do not accept losers or trailer trash. Children need to be aware of the online predator who exploits children for abductions, rapes, worse! I feel sympathy for this mother and child.

ajohnb, Jenks (7/18/2009 5:52:34 PM)

I agree with the others that a Red Flag should have gone up in the mom's mind when she was asked about the robe.

Did she just blow that off????? Read more about it in tomorrows paper. I know that I would like to know.

Human1 you make a good point, but be sure to include racists like Jesse Jackson,Oprah, Jeremiah Wright, and Al Sharpton.

As long as they make racist commentary then racism will live on, also.

It is not just white people that are racist.

human1, Path to Change OK (7/18/2009 6:05:25 PM)

tao4mind...They just do not accept losers or trailer trash.

I agree children need to be aware of Terrorist Organization for which the KKK has always been.

I could not find anything about Skull and Bones being Part of the KKK. George Bush was a member of Skulls and Bones and so was Jonh Kerry.
To glorify the KKK by making it sound like a university organization whose members are only colloge graduates is misleading. The KKK has always been an organization who spread propoganda about race, catholocism, or jewish people. They have a history of murder.

They often walked 11th street passing out cards to get members.

Children should be made aware of their terrosist activities and murders of blacks, jews, and catholics. The sad part is they use religion something Okies claim they are full of to attempt to sound legitimate. Out state representative do not sound to much different than the propoganda they spread.

Oklahoma needs to show it is becoming less racist.
Our prison population does a far cry from that!

Children do not always listen to their parents. You cannot blame the mother. The blame goes on the KKK.

GrannyTazzy, Tulsa (7/18/2009 6:06:32 PM)

I thought they taught about the KKK in school now, thought it was part of history, a bad part, but it is history, and hopefully before too long, it will be just that.."HISTORY". My kids knew about the KKK, and they are 25 & 29. Sorry for the mom's loss, but like alot of you say, should've could've..

human1, Path to Change OK (7/18/2009 6:16:11 PM)

ajohnb....be sure to include racists like Jesse Jackson,Oprah, Jeremiah Wright, and Al Sharpton.

I would never deny predudice exist everywhere. It is my opinion that prejudice by blacks is a result of the oppression they have either experienced, or have had family who experienced it. It usually is a defense to oppression. How many rich white men do you know of that are oppressed. They are the Leaders and the ones with power! You do not have to like Jesse Jackson but he was marching with Martin Luther King prior to his assasination. I withhold opinion of Mr. Sharpton.
The constant degroatory remakes on this blog about black people or mexican's or poor people or disabled people is a sign prejudice is alive in Tulsa.

human1, Path to Change OK (7/18/2009 6:43:42 PM)

Cythia Lynch was 43 years Old.

Rocketman, Tulsa (7/18/2009 7:05:45 PM)

These scum need the harshest punishment available - if they are convicted of course.

barracuda, (7/18/2009 7:14:40 PM)

This woman did not go to the meeting to embrace evil, she was not capable of that. she was not a normal 43 year old.

"It is my opinion that prejudice by blacks is a result of the oppression they have either experienced, or have had family who experienced it. It usually is a defense to oppression."

That is really a load of crap. Prejudice is a result of ignorance and hate, You do not have to be oppressed to be prejudiced. That is just an excuse, and not a very good one at that. We have all met people from all races who are prejudiced. Many people are prejudiced because of misinformation passed down from generation to generation, it is not just a white problem.

CWG, Tulsa (7/18/2009 7:35:37 PM)

A little bit of common sense at a bad time brought about her demise.

BWR, (7/18/2009 8:01:17 PM)

The KKK is largely made up of ignorant, un-educated religious fanatics who's only sense of self-worth is the terrorizing of people because they happen not to be white. They are non-Christian cowards who at one time had hijacked the Christian faith. Sadly, these parasites still exist along with the Taliban. They should fight each other and then the rest of us should kill the winners. I have always believed that the fraternal aspect of the klan is really inspired by an undercurrent of homosexuality. It is their common glue. They hide behind robes. They are mostly men. They meet secretly and they appear to display a rather touchy-feely affection for one another in public demonstration and especially so in the prison setting. My apologies to gays everywhere. I am a lifelong Oklahoman and I'm moving into my old age. It wouldn't bother me a second to burn down their meeting house in Collinsville with all of them in it. Those thugs they call a police department in Collinsville should really pay more attention to what goes on right under their noses.

CWG, Tulsa (7/18/2009 8:25:57 PM)

BWR, KKK has nothing to do with religion or homosexuality,please expose what is happening in Collinsville.

stormytyca, Tulsa (7/18/2009 8:46:58 PM)

human1:
"It is my opinion that prejudice by blacks is a result of the oppression they have either experienced, or have had family who experienced it. It usually is a defense to oppression. How many rich white men do you know of that are oppressed."

Did we forget the Jews? Most of them, during WW2, and even today, that felt/feel oppression from organizations like the original Nazis, neo-nazis, KKK, etc, were quite wealthy, in fact.

If you want to talk actual "slavery", I do not know of any RICH white men that were slaves, but I do know that, before the Europeans went to Africa for slaves, they had enslaved each other (most of the slaves were white people from the same or neighboring country as their "masters") for centuries. How do you think they knew how to go about it?

That being said, there is no reason to use oppression for lashing out with derogatory remarks. You don't see the Jewish people going on the air, and calling people names in a childish and over-aggressive manner, do you?

stormytyca, Tulsa (7/18/2009 8:47:56 PM)

apologies, that last paragraph should read "...to use oppression as an excuse for lashing out..."

optimistic realist, tulsa (7/18/2009 9:19:23 PM)

to barracuda:
BRAVO. compliments to your point well made. i couldn't agree more. it's all derived from fear...

tao4mind, Enid (7/18/2009 9:29:59 PM)

human1, sorry but I have documentation from 1937 that these two groups did indeed merge. Their power lies in the economy, own all the International banks, the oil-businesses, the most powerful businesses of industry and trade, they infiltrate politics and education and they own most governments. They are connected by bloodlines going back thousands and thousands of years in time, and they are very careful with keeping those bloodlines as pure as possible from generation to generation. What is driving them is power, money and control. These groups of 8 to 20 members using the name and internet are role playing. The real threat of oppression and assassinations are prompted by ideological, political, or military reasons. The racism has moved to the working class.

SoonerChris, Tulsa (7/18/2009 9:36:08 PM)

I wonder how many of you that seem to have so much compassion for this lady would have befriended / embraced her if you met her on the street. I believe if you want to change the world do not talk about how much you care for a lost soul that has passed instead embrace a lost soul so you might save it.

rockfan, broken arrow (7/18/2009 10:24:48 PM)

Why does anyone join a group?
Most often to be with like minded people.
But,with radical groups like the neo-Nazis,Communists,Islamic Jihadi's or whatever,i think more often than not it's lonely people,possibly with low self esteem and maybe not a very strong personality,looking for a sense of belonging or a leader to give them a sense of direction.

Theres a movie called "American history X" about skinheads, that would be very enlightening for young vulnerable and impressionable young people to see.
Because it demonstrates what those racist jerks are really all about.

Bedazzled, (7/18/2009 10:56:27 PM)

The word KKK should have waved a Red Flag to her mother. This girl was not normal.

ajohnb, Oprah doesn't fall in this catagory. I have never heard any of the such. How about adding Pat Robertson and Jimmy Swaggart to your list.

Bedazzled, (7/18/2009 10:58:05 PM)

Corporations have been running this country for a long time. Not the people.

mandie, (7/19/2009 12:32:14 AM)

Racism is a state of mind, how people were raised. I hate when minorities play the "minority card" I am married to a minority and he refuses to yell racism. I on the other had have worked with a african american who makes comments about me being white, racist comments. I have been told not to defend myself and point out she is the one making everything a race issue. Why is it she can do it and it is accepted BUT if I even defend myself I am looked at poorly. There is racism from every race and it is ignorant people who make the comments......they need someone below them, or an excuse for their actions. GET OVER IT! We are all equals, no life is greater or lesser in the eyes of GOD and until every person of every color realizes it we will be torn.

jestergrl1, Mannford (7/19/2009 12:37:43 AM)

Geess, didn't you all read the article? This girl had some mental issues regardless of her age. Apparently her Mother has some issues too. In earlier articles it was suggested that she was mentally ill.

Bullhead, Nicut (7/19/2009 5:34:18 AM)

mandie, You're right. I've been in your position more than once except that it was a minority making those types of comments to me, another minority!

jester, this is why the mother came forward to be interviewed. So we all could hear the real story about Cynthia.

Popeye, T-Town (7/19/2009 6:45:09 AM)

Sorry for your loss, Virginia. Your daughter appears to have been a special person in many ways, and a very lucky girl. It's only a fortunate few that have the love of a mother like you -- thank you for sharing your daughter's story.

And thanks for giving us all pause, in this difficult and dangerous world.

What in the World!, Tulsa, OK (7/19/2009 7:35:53 AM)

"I think if some one would had picked her up and taken her to church it would have made a world of difference" My question is why couldn't it have been you? I am sorry for your loss, however do you think you should have done anything different before you moved 110 miles away from your schizophrenic / bipolar (since age 11) daughter?

The Lunch Lady, Tulsa (7/19/2009 7:53:27 AM)

To What in the World!

Why in the world would your reaction to this article--instead of being sorrow for the loss of this woman's life or anger that hate groups like the KKK take advantage of innocents and murder them or gratitude that the law enforcement authorities have these animals who killed this woman in custody--why in the world is your response to lash out at another victim in this horrible crime--the mother?

Who in the world do you think you are that you can say such a thing to the mother of a murdered child?

How in the world do many who post on TW find it acceptable to be the judge, jury, and emotional executioner of perfect strangers?

Popeye--Thank you for your comments to the mother. Appropriate and heart felt when just finding the right words are so difficult.

TulGal, Tulsa (7/19/2009 9:20:51 AM)

jestergrl1--I challenge you to search the archives of the TW and tell us when you read that the mother had mental problems. You do know how to do this, don't you? I looked...and didn't find a thing. Unless you can prove your point, you owe Virginia Lynch an apology.

my view, Sand Springs (7/19/2009 9:59:05 AM)

Duped? She knew what the KKK is, a group of people with small minds.

Meowlicious, (7/19/2009 10:20:16 AM)

I have a child who could easily be in the same position. He is autistic and has no concept of social clues. We have to watch every interaction he has with others and keep very close tabs on the friends he makes because people can very easily take advantage of him. I have already been informed by his Dr.s that we are never going to be able to send him off to college and he is probably never going to be able to live on his own.

This is a tragic case as it seems to me that this woman should have been much more closely supervised, not just by the mother, but by the community. We are capable of higher thinking, so what I don't get is why do people not understand by now that we need to be kind and reach out to those who are different from us? I remember being younger and not being nice to a certain man in my town who drives a golfcart around and I "hated" him because everyone else did. I see him now, probably in his 60's and I understand that he is mentally ill.... but until I was around more compassionate people as I grew up, I never even knew to think about how other people would feel or think about why they acted the way they did.
We need to teach our children to be compassionate to others even when they are different from us. If someone had simply reached out to this woman this would have never happened, but all of society rejected her and she had to find solace in the absoloute dredges of society... and yet she didn't have the capability to understand that. All she wanted was friendship.
My child is in a class to learn social skills, he is never going to "get it" like everyone else... which means that I pretty much can't ever die. Do you know how terrifying that is?

Meowlicious, (7/19/2009 10:24:58 AM)

Virginia, I applaud you for coming out to discuss this tragedy. You are making the best of the situation by creating an open dialouge about this issue. I know it must be terribly painful for you, but this is something we need to be talking about to better help others in the future...My heart is with you.

Nuff, (7/19/2009 11:10:12 AM)

I agree with 'What in the World'. If the woman was a virtual shut-in then why didn't her mother move her to OKC? Why is it someone else’s responsibility to take her to church? The article doesn’t mention that she attended church or that her mother made efforts to get her involved in a local church. Surely if she was attending church efforts would have been made to get her there.

Her death is tragic and I am sympathetic to her mother’s grief. The loss of a child is devastating.

Mom needs to take ownership and responsibility for her part of this tragedy.

This article paints mom in a bad light.

Billie08, (7/19/2009 11:18:57 AM)

It is so sad that you lost your daughter, and I feel for you. But you have to think about this, she was going to join a Klan that kills other peoples children too.

DeeBee, (7/19/2009 11:37:43 AM)

Sadly, this doesn't surprise me coming from Oklahoma.

jestergrl1, Mannford (7/19/2009 11:55:46 AM)

Tulgal,
Do I need to say more with the updated article? Maybe I read it off of the News6 website where the girl was childlike in earlier articles.

Skeptic, Tulsa (7/19/2009 1:43:28 PM)

"Duped? She knew what the KKK is, a group of people with small minds." - my view

Did you not read the article mv? Her mother clearly explained the young lady's mental capacity. I would imagine that she was duped by reading something that gave her hope of being included.

The following line is from a KKK group in Harrison, AR:

"Bringing a Message of Hope and Deliverance to White Christian America! A Message of Love NOT Hate!"

The KKK is now preaching LOVE as it attempts to draw others in. Evil intents are still at the heart of these hate groups.

My sympathy to the mother of this child. My disgust to those who would defend hate groups and racism.

Edgar, Norman, (7/19/2009 1:50:07 PM)

Sad. Develpmentally delayed people are often taken advantage of by unsavory types.

Ayo, T-Town (7/19/2009 2:17:08 PM)

"No fan of the KKK here - but how is that any different than the NAACP or the reverends Wright and Farrakhan?"

Easy answer brother yaki, the NAACP has not ever held clandestine meetings in the dark of the night. They've never hidden their faces and bodies beneath robes and hoods. They've never gone to a man's home in the middle of the night to hang him from a tree while burning down his house.

Capiche?

You can put a saddle on a dog, but he's still dog.

sister sue, independence, (7/19/2009 2:32:26 PM)

Sister Sue

Cynthia was my half-sister. I have not seen her since she was 16 years old. She was in institutions from 11 to 18 (according to her mother). She got married, divorced, then her mother became her legal guardian again. Her mother didn't have her live near her, or take a job near Cynthia. The key word is guardian.

sister sue, independence, (7/19/2009 2:45:29 PM)

on the fence, tulsa

You do not know the mother. I do.

FS, Broken Arrow (7/19/2009 4:27:20 PM)

When this happened, am I mistaken or do I remember something in the World about Cynthia working for/with the FBI re: this KKK group?

sister sue, independence, (7/19/2009 4:37:33 PM)

Cynthia never worked for the FBI. It was her mother who cooperated with the FBI, because the FBI wanted the computer.

I do not believe Cynthia ever worked. According to her mother, Virginia was going to see her that weekend. Convinced that her daughter understood, Lynch made plans to come to Tulsa that weekend to clean Cynthia's apartment and take her grocery shopping. If Cynthia wasn't there, where did she think she was. Her mother told me they talked on the phone everyday. Why didn't Virginia call the FBI then? Why did she wait 3 weeks later to find out my sister was murdered.

ajohnb, Jenks (7/19/2009 5:31:47 PM)

Funny how everyone becomes a victim, regardless of choices that they made or responsibilities they should have taken.

If Cynthia was so bad off mentally, why would her mother ever have left her on her own? Maybe the mother had other priorities or someone in her life or maybe she just did not want to mess with or have time for Cynthia.

You don't quit being a parent because the child is 43 years old. And if this child was not functioning mentally at age 43, you should have been VERY concerned that her conversation went as far as asking you to make her a KKK robe. But all she did was tell her to "stay away from them because they will hurt you".

Wizzened Old Timer, (7/19/2009 5:34:41 PM)

tao4mind makes a very good case for better schools, although he probably didn't know he was making that good an argument.

sister sue, independence, (7/19/2009 5:50:45 PM)

ajohnb

You hit the nail on the head. I know her mother.

I hope someone checks out her and Cynthia's cell phone calls, during her stay in Louisiana.

Ayo, T-Town (7/19/2009 7:09:49 PM)

sister sue, what does your post imply? That Cynthia's mother knew she was in LA, and why she was there?

I really don't know what to say about the mother. Certainly, I understand her wanting her daughter to be able to live on her own. In hindsight it probably would have been better for Cynthia to have been involved in some sort of group that checks in on or helps someone with her mental capacity. Did she live in a halfway house? I don't recall.

Either way, hindsight is better than foresight. I kind of doubt that Cynthia had a good understanding of what the KKK was about. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think so.

Skeptic, Tulsa (7/19/2009 7:12:29 PM)

Again, the wingnuts are attempting to make the victim responsible for her own death. Defending those who killed this unfortunate soul speaks volumes about why hate groups are comfortable in this part of the country. It's pathetic.

sister sue, independence, (7/19/2009 7:24:22 PM)

ayo

you are also correct. I guess Virginia wants the attention. She is acting like she is the victim and not Cynthia. I would like for someone to pay for what they did. Starting with Virginia.

ajohnb, Jenks (7/19/2009 7:26:07 PM)

Skeptic, no one is defending these creeps that killed her. You sure try to read evil into all comments.

But there are some people that could step up and take some of the responsibility for her actions given that she had some mental handicaps.

I understand that being responsible for your own actions and not always being the victim is foreign territory for you. But no one is defending what the KKK did. It was murder through and through and those guys need to pay for what they did.

Bullhead, Nicut (7/19/2009 7:26:27 PM)

God bless you, Virginia. I hope you find peace somehow.

sister sue, independence, (7/19/2009 7:54:21 PM)

ajohnb

out of 8 kkk members, 4 members were not charged.
1 pleaded guilty, sentenced to 4 yrs.,(will be out sooner). l was to serve a year (out in six months for good behavior). 1 will probably never to to trial (did not understand that it was against the law to murder someone) and the only one left hasn't even gone to trail yet. His latest date is July 27, 2009, but because of his lawyers and his rights, it will probably be postponed again. Cynthia was the victim. What happened to her rights?

Chuck Foxen, Tulsa (7/19/2009 8:19:13 PM)

All Churches that preach hate are the same. KKK is no different than a church that says being gay is a sin. We in Oklahoma have many churches that preach hate in a nice pretty little package.

sister sue, independence, (7/19/2009 8:27:14 PM)

bullhead

I hope she finds peace also, But she needs to apologize to Cynthia for allowing Cynthia to get into this mess. Virginia also needs to apologize to everyone else for her actions. Because her past just caught up with her.

Skeptic, Tulsa (7/19/2009 8:33:39 PM)

"You sure try to read evil into all comments" ajohnb

I don't try to read evil into anything, I recognize it. Many here have attempted to suggest that this 70 year old mother was at fault for not better protecting her daughter. By doing so, you divert attention from the true villains, the KKK killers.

This 70 y/o mother had 43 years with her child and probably understood her moods, fears and abilities very well. Suggesting that the mother is to blame even in part, diminishes the role of the radical right extremist group that lured her to her death.

Skeptic, Tulsa (7/19/2009 8:49:19 PM)

Chuck Foxen, a M O R O N, Yakimoto?

I'd call him a wise realist.

Skeptic, Tulsa (7/19/2009 9:14:48 PM)

Oh Yakimoto, try to be a little more original. I used that line a few days ago on one of your cronies who wanted to marry her dog.

You need to get out more!

terryf, (7/19/2009 9:16:34 PM)

To those who think the mom could have done something. ... It is next to impossible to stop bipolar person who has gotten wrapped up into odd behavior and in this case bad people. There isnt much you can do to stop them because they do not understand rationality when in a meltdown or a manic episode, etc.

sister sue, independence, (7/19/2009 9:31:39 PM)

All of you who feel sorry for the mother, just thank you lucky stars, that you didn't have to live with her. I know this woman, and in 42 years, she has not changed one bit. She blames everyone else for her actions. Bottom line, She did not protect her child.

Skeptic, Tulsa (7/19/2009 9:35:55 PM)

Sorry to disappoint you Yakimoto. My partner and I are happily hitched. lol

ajohnb, Jenks (7/19/2009 9:40:17 PM)

So the daughter asking her mother to sew her a KKK robe should not have set off any "red flags" with the mother?

Well, okay, if you see it that way.

And Skeptic, "radical right extremist group"????

Even David Duke, the Grand Wizard of the KKK ran for President in 1988 as a Democrat.

ajohnb, Jenks (7/19/2009 9:43:30 PM)

sister sue, I can only imagine the frustration you are experiencing over this.

My thoughts and prayers are with you.

sister sue, independence, (7/19/2009 9:57:48 PM)

thank you ajohnb

you are the first person to see through the lines. I appreciate your kindness. I am not a mean person or am I vindictive. I know everything will be okay in the end.

if my memory serves me right, Isn't David Duke from Louisiana?

ajohnb, Jenks (7/19/2009 10:15:48 PM)

sister sue,

thank you for your comments. I, too, know that everything will be okay in the end. Perseverance is the key word. And those men will pay for their crimes sooner or later.

As much as I hate to announce it, David Duke was born in Tulsa, but moved a lot and was raised in Louisiana. He was an infant when they left Tulsa for the Netherlands and then to Louisiana.

He joined the KKK in Louisiana and graduated from LSU in Baton Rouge. Louisiana has always been his base of operations and where he ran all of his political campaigns from.

sheez, (7/19/2009 10:34:04 PM)

I surprised that her mother just let her go with a sink or swim attitude. Knowing her daughter was diagnosed bipolar. Good grief! This is not a person that was just imature, she had mental limitations that left her vulnerable. There are bipolar support groups or even churches that mom could have connected her with if she was going to leave her behind. Rather than "Hope" a church just comes along why didn't she help her daughter find a church family so at least the daughter had some kind of support to help her and help check up on her. My son is bipolar with a very high IQ but, I would never just leave him behind and hope someone else comes along to pick up the pieces where mom left off. This was a special needs child and mom even states that she was a child so mom, my question is why did you leave your child alone in this crazy world?

okie ridgerunner, Small Country Town State Line (7/19/2009 11:05:29 PM)

I feel sad for the mother.

Tutt'sville, Tulsa (7/19/2009 11:29:33 PM)

First - I am so very very sorry for your loss, Mrs. Lynch. So sorry that you lost your beautiful, special daughter and my heart goes out to you. May God grant you peace and please know that there was nothing that you could have done to prevent what happened, in spite of the hardened, mean-spirited comments of those on this site who count themselves among humanity. They are blind because they cannot or will not see. As a black person, even I know in my heart that your daughter meant no malice because she did not have the capacity to for it - she was an innocent. Please try to stop trembling. Cynthia's soul is in Heaven today and she feels no pain, no sadness, no loss - only the overwhelming, complete love of Heavenly. In some cultures, the people mourn when a child is born and rejoice when an earthly life comes to a close because earth is the garden of evil, in spite of the hollow lives of those who are enjoying it to the fullest, to the extent that they feel compelled to persecute and destroy by words or deeds the lives of others. Sorrow and pain is not God's plan for our lives, neither is the evil that is everywhere on earth although we have to deal with it when it is our time. When this life is over, there will be no memory of sorrow or pain, persecution, hatred, or ignorance, nor will there be a place for those who have caused it. Also, please know that the hearts of the sane and humble go out to you in your grief and we know that you are suffering and would comfort you if we could. In the book of Psalms it reads ... "For blessed are the pure in heart for they shall see God" . . .Your daughter was pure in heart and no one who knows her or has learned of her through you would believe that she would ever do anything intentionally evil - unlike many in this city and state who believe themselvess christians or that they are wise. They are fools who have become arrogant in their evil and ignorance - just as the Bible foretold they would.

One day, all eyes will be opened by the one who judges and only then will we see clearly how much has been lost for nothing at all. Only then it will be too late. I wish you peace, sister.

Twilight in Paris, near the water in SE OK (7/20/2009 1:29:56 PM)

It's sad that this happened to such a nice woman. This mother had no idea what was going on with her daughter, other then she mentioned the KKK, she didn't tell her mother she was going to LA, that happened later. It's a really tragic story that the KKK 'people' didn't let her leave once she realized what she was getting into...it would have saved a lot of heartache and a lot of tax payer's money.

InnocentUntil...., (7/20/2009 1:41:49 PM)

To optimistic realist & barracuda: Unless either one of you is black, do us a favor and let us speak for ourselves. Why do you feel the need to make comments on something you most likely will never understand? Live one day in my grandmothers & greatgrandmothers shoes and then you can comment on how she should feel.

Of The Sea, Tulsa (7/20/2009 4:06:27 PM)

I see a couple of comments about how the mother could leave her daughter here and move away... While it's hard for me as a parent to imagine just picking up and moving away from my daughter, especially if she had problems like this, I can kind of understand why the mother did that. I have a handicapped uncle who is in his 50s and he so fiercely wants his independence that he regularly runs off and gets married the minute my Mom turns her head. She has had to repeatedly clean up the messes he gets himself into, for years, and no matter how we try to help him, he so badly wants to be on his own that he truly resents the "intrusion" into his life. Maybe Cynthia wanted to feel like she could handle her life on her own. Regardless of the reasoning behind all of this, it's so sad and I feel so badly for her and her mother. Poor little thing, truly not knowing any better and getting killed for it. And for her mother.. it sounds like she tried to stop her and Cynthia just took off before her mother could get to her. I don't know, but it's all very sad. God bless them both.

Of The Sea, Tulsa (7/20/2009 4:16:57 PM)

BuddyLee - Agreed. It says that she did tell her they were bad people who would hurt her, but I am with you in wondering if maybe she could have been a little more detailed? Maybe she thought Cynthia couldn't handle it, or maybe she thought the explanation she offered was the end of the conversation. Maybe the daughter dropped it and the mother thought she understood? I don't know. So sad.

human1, Path to Change OK (7/20/2009 5:18:11 PM)

stormytyca...."Did we forget the Jews? Most of them, during WW2, and even today, that felt/feel oppression from organizations like the original Nazis, neo-nazis, KKK"

My previous comment mentioned the KKK had terrorized the Blacks, Catholics, and JEWS.
I am sorry you misunderstood the intent of what I said.

To those who feel this mother should have protected her 43 year old daughter, you need to look up Oklahoma Guardianship law. Without a guardianship over her person the mom legally has no authority to force the adult handicapped child to do anything. Even a guardianship makes it difficult to get assistance. 50% of hospitals ignore guardianships. If the mother had a guardianship she might have asked the court to involuntarily put her daughter in Tulsa Institute for Behavior Health against her will. The judges still would have to have determined she was in need of treatment to keep her daughter in the hospital. If she was not dangerous to herself or others in open statements in front of the police or COPES I doubt anyone could have prevented her from going to Louisiana.

The culprit is the KKK not the Mother!

And the KKK is not an organization only made of ignorant people. David Duke was a senator and Grand Wizard of the Louisiana KKK. There have been many important people involved with this terrorist organization.

Education the KKK is a Terrorist Organization is what everyone needs. Religious propoganda is no help either. I have never understood why it still exists!

It it sad this still happens in the 21st century!

I am very sorry for what the mother must go through and sorry for her lose.

human1, Path to Change OK (7/20/2009 6:19:44 PM)

When you handicapped child turns 18 the Law sees them as an indivual not your child!

There are two type of Gaurdianships, one over the person, and one over the property. You have to ask for both to get both.

The courts have determined that institutionalization is the equivilent of incarceration since you are taking away a persons rights and locking them up. It cannot be done simply because you disagree with the handicapped adult child.

The trend in mental health has been to have the mentally ill live away from the family and try to be as independant as possible.

Most of you do not know what you are talking about, when it comes to adults that are handicapped and thinking the parents have rights to control them forever, even if they wanted to.

Before you make these cruel judgements on this mother go talk to a lawyer, and the police, and the mental health association!

sister sue, independence, (7/20/2009 6:39:24 PM)

There wasn't a problem with her living away from the family. Her mother sent her away when she was 11. Then she married her off to a man old enough to be her father. Listen to the tape again.She talked to Cynthia every day. I know Virginia. I talked to her two days ago, and she tried to lie to me. Virginia tried to have me put away when I was a child. And it wasn't because I was the bad one. And where is Cynthia's brother in all of this. No one has heard from him. Virginia just wants everyone to think she is the victim. But it is Cynthia who is. If Virginia cared so much, why didn't she live closer and take Cynthia to church herself?
They didn't have to live in the same complex? The only one Virginia can blame for Cynthia is Virginia.

sister sue, independence, (7/20/2009 6:49:13 PM)

Cynthia wasn't buried under an alias. She was buried under her birth name Cynthia Charlotte Bailey. Her death certificate even shows Edward Bailey as her father.

ajohnb, Jenks (7/20/2009 7:50:27 PM)

Ok human1 you made a point with the Oklahoma Guardianship law.

I guess with that law in place, then it takes away the rights and responsibilites you have as a mother? NOT!!!

43 or 73, your mother is still your mother and should still care enough for you to point out errors that you make.

Just because you don't have "authority" over children, especially those that are handicapped, does that relieve you of your parental duties to care for your children when possible?

Maybe you would not, but I would definetly step between my "majority age" children and something that I perceieve could be a danger to them. They can hate me or thank me after, but I would know that I did everything I could do to help them choose the right path.

I can only imagine what kind of parent you are. Hope your kids never make decisions that could be harmful to themselves. And I am not saying that to slam you.

sister sue, independence, (7/20/2009 9:29:23 PM)

of the sea

listen to the tape again. Virginia even told me she talked to Cynthia every day. Virginia even told me she knew Cynthia was in Louisiana. Why as a mother didn't Virginia call the authorities? Because Virginia wanted someone else to take the responsibility of taking care of Cynthia. Like she expected a Church to take care of her. Like she expected an institution to take care of her. like she expected a husband to take care of her. are you getting the picture? Virginia kept her away from her biological family. We weren't even allowed to see her. Virginia didn't even let us know when she was murdered. I found out by accident on the internet five months after it happened. What does that tell you about her?

human1, Path to Change OK (7/21/2009 2:12:02 AM)

ajohnb...Just because you don't have "authority" over children, especially those that are handicapped, does that relieve you of your parental duties to care for your children when possible?

I beleive we should do all we can to help our children even when they become adults and expecially if they have a disability.

There are laws that will interefere with your ability to protect your child with a handicapp even with a gaurdianship. The HIPPA laws have made it even harder. You also have to carry the gaurdianship papers on you at all times. Many hospitals and psychiatric clinics and the police totally ignore the documents. You can file a complaint with the ODMSA but that does not help you at the moment!

It is sad and very frustrating! There are not many places to help in such situations. The only thing you can do is attempt to get the court involved in taking your childs rights away if they will not listen to you if YOU are that determined. When you do that a sheffif will approach your child out of the blue and tell them they are being taken into protective custody if the judge approves for that to happen. Your adult child will be hand cuffed then taken to a mental hospital for evaluation. That does not mean they were be kept at the hospital. They have to be dangerous to themselves or others. If the child says they were not doing anything dangerous but only wanted to go to Lousianna you are SOL!

You do that very many times and your adult child is going to become very parinoid of the police.

This is a difficult situation with no easy solution. Ask a lawyer! Ask the Mental Health Association.

The end result is the KKK killed this woman!

I do not hear anyone very concerned about the KKK!

They are a terrorist organization with a bunch of religious propoganda spreading to make themsleves look not so bad!

Bless you and your ignorance of how the system works!

ajohnb, Jenks (7/21/2009 7:11:46 AM)

human1 if you will look at my post above, you will see the disdain for the KKK. I blame them entirely for the cowardly acts they performed.

But you and I will disagee on the role of the mother here.

You want to stand by the victims "rights" to be independant and act like an adult whether she had the capacity to make rational judgements. Thats not for you or I to judge.

My point is, the mother could have done a lot more to protect her child when she heard her talking about the KKK and running off to join them.

You may want to read sister sue's posts and hear it from someone that was closer to the situation than you or I will be.

The state or governemnt does not always fix everything and believe it or not, not every person has the ability to live and function on their own as an adult regardless of what the law says.

I pity the person like you that would refuse to help his or her children because there are laws that say the children do not have to accept your help.

Just line up your lawyers and the mental health association and let them advise you all you want on how to take care of your children. I am sure they can quote you all types of laws so you don't harm your child's pysche.

They or their policies would not keep me from doing everything I could do to save my child from harm. Having a child paranoid of the police is much better than a dead child.

Please read sister sue's posts about the mother.

human1, Path to Change OK (7/21/2009 11:12:23 AM)

ajohnb...You want to stand by the victims "rights" to be independant and act like an adult whether she had the capacity to make rational judgements. Thats not for you or I to judge.
The KKK killed this woman. I do know the law, and have been very active in mental health advocacy and helping homeless. Have You!

Our laws recognize a person as an adult at 18. The court can find someone incompetant and appoint a gaurdian. Or the court can appoint a guardian only as the person taking care of someones property. Are you sure the court had declared Ms. Lynch incompetent.

The problems is even if she is incompotent the only way the mother can force her daughter to do anything against her will is through the court!
I do not know if the mother attempted to use the courts and to have her daughter committed to some type of facility once she was over 18. But it is up to the doctor once that person is in custody to determine if they reamain in custody. Oklahoma got a D in integrated services for the mentally ill. The article says Ms. Lynch had Schezophrenia.

The funds have not been there to assist the mentally ill due to our congress not caring much about this issue.

There are very specific laws under Oklahoma Mental Health law which restrict the gaurdian and hospital and courts ability to institutionalize any person. The general rule is they have to do something infront of the police or say to the doctor something that indicates they are dangerous to self or others. (what you think is dangerous and what a doctor thinks is dangerous usually will not conincide) That is IT!

The police will not take someone to the hospital against their will even if they have a guardian if they have not met those standards!

We do not have permanent institutions for the mentally ill unless you have been declared criminally insane. You can talk to the courts about their decisions on that, not me. We offer group home's out in the country but even someone with a guardian can walk away at will from them.
They are out in the middle of no where.

Tulsa residents have been fighting against the Mental Health Facility being built on Yale. Most poeple do not want mentally ill people around and could care less about them. This sterotype has been had to break. People think a mentally ill person living next to them will lower the value of their property. That is the christian attitude in Tulsa and most cities.

If you want to do something other than spout things you do not know about, go volunteer at the Mental Health Association. Go advocate for better housing for the mentally ill. Take in a homeless person. Write letters to your representatives to spend more money on assistance for people like Ms. Lynch. Tell them to spend it on treatment rather than prisons. 50% of the mentally ill get there treatment in prisons. That is because of the way the laws are written.

A gaurdiaship is not a hook and chain on a person!
If you are mentally ill or incompotent you can still be found guilty of a crime. The court does not care if you had a guardian if you are accused of a crime. It is a meaningless document!

Get rid of the KKK. This is who killed Ms. Lynch.
Tell your congressman you do not want hate crime groups that murder and kill people to get tax deductions.

Get REAL. The mom may have made mistakes. I do not know. I know the guardianship is not what YOU think it is in most cases.

This is sad. The KKK is the murderer!!!!!!

ajohnb, Jenks (7/21/2009 1:00:23 PM)

Funny how you slam me because I think the mother should have taken a more active role in what her daughter was doing and help protect her.

But you say that the mother did not need to be involved because the victim was 43 and nobody has the right to interfere with her life.

But you also say that you are involved with the mentally challenged to a great degree.

WHY?

If these people can make their own decisions and be responsible for their actions, then why are YOU involved in their lives?

You have totally distorted what I have said. I agree the KKK killed her and they should be punished to the full extent of the law. But I also said that the mother had warning flags with her daughter and she did nothing to dissuade her daughter from making a mistake.

Throw in all you want about the mental health advocacy. You seem to think that just because someone would help these people then that would be a slight to them.

So she was an adult and made her own decisions. Now she is dead. And those that had knowledge of pending dangerous conclusions did nothing to act.

If that is the state of the mental health advocacy in Oklahoma, that they would do nothing to help someone in this situation for fear of "making them paranoid" of the police, then I don't want anything to do with the organization.

This is my last post to this thread. We can argue back and forth all day. Bottom line is the woman is dead. My she rest i more peace than she had on this earth.

human1, Path to Change OK (7/21/2009 2:38:15 PM)

ajohn..Funny how you slam me because I think the mother should have taken a more active role in what her daughter was doing and help protect her.

I apologize if it look like I am slaming you.
You were tossing out a few things that might look like insults.

I believe you care about this woman. My only point is once you are an adult and even with a guardian it takes the court to place a person in protective custody but it is still the psychiatric doctors that decide if they remain at the hospital, or placed in some type of home not the gaurdian.

We want the mentally ill to live on thier own, but the services to help them are few and far between!

I admire you if you are the one that will fight for your child. Just be aware if this is your adult child the system is not there to lock people aways as a whole for thier own protection, and the courts do not care at all if someone is mentally ill there attitude is if you are 18 you are supposed to accept responsibility for your behavior even if it is irrational, criminal courts do not acknowled any guardians!
It has taken the supreme court to tell the states you cannot execute the mentally retarded. It was not DA's that did that. They try to execute the mentally hadicapped in the name of personal resonspibility and will tell the gaurdian to take a hike!

Peace!

human1, Path to Change OK (7/21/2009 3:01:23 PM)

Last note on this thread.

The KKK killed this woman. You have no idea how many police harm the mentally ill and get away with it! They have to deal with that daily. Ignorant police and Ignorant District Attorney Looking to coving up the wrongs of the police.

50% of the mentally Ill get treatment in jail. The Police and Courts do not care about the mentally ill. They law says you are responsible and if the police do not understand mental illness then they abuse the mentally ill, they beat them up and falsely charge them.

That is probably more of a concern than the KKK because it is something the mentally ill are around more often. Tulsa has a good police force. That is not the case with the suburbs.

human1, Path to Change OK (7/21/2009 3:05:30 PM)

If you have someone you love with a mental illness you love make sure you stay away for Tulsa's suburbs.

sister sue, independence, (7/21/2009 4:33:52 PM)

human 1

The FBI has been watching Chuck Foster for seven years, and they have not done anything about him or his group in that time. He only gets charged for 2nd degree murder. Murder is murder. Of the eight people. 4 of them were released, no charges.

1 pleaded guilty to obstruction of justice, was sentenced to 4 years, will be out sooner.( Obstruction of justice can carry a 40 year sentence.)

1 was sentenced for a year, out in 6 months for good behavior. Obstruction of justice.

1 will probably never go to trial (Chuck Foster's son), because he didn't know murder was against the law. (God's and Man's law)

As for Chuck Foster, he keeps getting his trial delayed. I wonder who the justice and lawyers really are that are working on this trial. Just remember it is Louisiana.

human1, Path to Change OK (7/22/2009 2:04:57 AM)

sister sue....As for Chuck Foster, he keeps getting his trial delayed. I wonder who the justice and lawyers really are that are working on this trial. Just remember it is Louisiana.

That was interesting information. This may sound cheap, but maybe Mr. Foster is one of those Mob Snitches, that work with the FBI, like the one who knew about the murder of a Bixby Ok Businessman a number or years ago.

sister sue, independence, (7/22/2009 5:07:53 AM)

human 1

You need to do your homework, and quit living in a maybe world. Maybe he knew about the family who had kkk painted on their home last week in mississippi. maybe he knew about the church burnings in la, tn, and arkansas. or maybe the cross burning in ark in 1969.

a lot of maybes. You must be a reporter. You don't get facts and the truth. I lived in Louisiana, Virginia lived in Louisiana. I have talked to the detectives. I also know a couple of people who was access to details.Louisiana is a beautiful state. But like everywhere else there is evil and bad.

I kept my mouth shut, until Virginia pulled the feel sympathy for me card. Virginia knew Cynthia was there. In Louisiana, if a handicapped person is in danger, the authorities can find that person. Virginia did nothing. Cell phones would have helped locate her.

I also talked to a church member,where Virginia said Cynthia liked to attend.

Again, I have done my homework. I am not going on a maybe.

Virginia was not the only one who lost Cynthia. Her sisters, her aunts, her uncles, her cousins, her nephews, her nieces, all lost for a second time.

human1, Path to Change OK (7/22/2009 2:34:49 PM)

sister sue...You need to do your homework, and quit living in a maybe world.
Sister sue, I have not made any judgement about this case of what what done to protect Ms. Lynch by her mother. I have only attempted to show that is it not that easy to institutionalize an adult person even if you have a gardianship.

I wish peace and someday closure to everyone who is affected by Ms. Lynch death. It is obvious you cared very much for her and are sorrowed by her death.

I only know what this story reported. I know the Mental Health System and law and how guardians are treated in this state. I am sorry you and Ajohn twisted my words and read things into what I said they were never said! It is cruel to accuse all guardians of an adult with a mental illness of not trying to protect their loved one when you obviously do not understand how the systems work in this state. It does not always protect your loved one the way many think it should.

Fact: the law says Patients with guardian still have some rights.

FACT: We have been moving away for involuntary institutionalization for years partly due to Supreme Court ruling concerning institutionalization being the equivalent of incarceration without being charged with a crime.

Fact: Generally you cannot institutionalize someone for thinking differently even if that may result in harm.

Fact: Our current system requires you threaten to do something dangerous to yourself or others in the presence of the doctor or police before the doctor will take your rights away. This can be very frustrating for a parent who may perceive the dangerous behavior and has to wait for the tragedy to happen before any help is offered! Then it is usually prison!
Fact: There has been a very recent changes to that law which involve deterioration but the people that have the ability to take someone to the hospital are the police they do not recognize that portion of the law, and most doctors do not recognize it yet either.

Fact: Doctors in state facilities usually never speak to the guardian. If you do not have the papers on you when the person is taken to the hospital the doctor is not even going to acknowledge you due to privacy rights of the patient! HIPPA laws may prevent the doctor from speaking to the guardian even if they have the guardianship papers.

Fact! Just because you ask the court to have a mentally ill person picked up against their will because of something you feel is harmful, does not mean the Judge will issue the order, or that the hospital will put than person in the hospital against their will.

FACT: Our current mental health system is disorganized. The state is working to change this but it takes funds and the legislature has been slow to fund any help for the mentally ill except through the prison systems because they have stockholders with the private prison who pay the representative campaign funds.

Fact: Most mentally ill are poor and do not have $1000.00 to hand a representative for a campaign fee, and that is all most of them they are concerned about! I say that due to the lack of funding

Fact: We all need to accept mental illness is a factor in our society and offer assistance and understanding rather than wishing they lived somewhere else. They deserve to attempt to live in a free society, rather than being warehoused in institutions where the family will have limited access to the care given and to see the patient.

sister sue, independence, (7/22/2009 4:25:29 PM)

human 1

Again, you are not paying attention.
She was in Louisiana, not Oklahoma. Any person with disabilities in Louisiana as well as in Missouri, if they are in any type of situation where family members feel they will be harmed, can get help. She had family members that are still in Louisiana. Her mother knew she was there. Her mother did not do anything. What are you not understanding?

I had to take care of Papa. He had his problems. More than once, I had to get the authorities to help, and I wasn't even his guardian. And we lived in Louisiana at the time.

As for ajohnb, he is one of the few who used common sense. He saw right through the snow job that was being played.

human1, Path to Change OK (7/22/2009 5:25:27 PM)

sister sue....human 1 Again, you are not paying attention she was in Louisana.

The story says the day Cynthia left Tulsa she asked her Mother to make a robe for her. The story says her mother lived in Oklahoma. It is not clear in the story exactly when she moved to Lousiana.

I do not know what would happen in Lousiana if you report a mentally ill person missing or in need of assistance if they are adult.
If you report a mentally ill person over 18 missing in this state nothing will be done. The police will tell the adult if they see them they will pick them up but they will not got looking for them. Fact!

sister sue, independence, (7/22/2009 5:32:30 PM)

glad i don't live in Oklahoma anymore.

human1, Path to Change OK (7/22/2009 5:44:14 PM)

sister sue..I am very sorry for your loss and the families loss. This was eveidently very difficult.

I am glad Louisianna has laws to protect the disabled, because Oklahoma doen't once you turn 18 no matter what you are on your own. Some police respect the fact there is a guardian and others see you as a nusiance. It is difficult to get the Crisis team to check on someone in this state, they truly believe if you are 18 your family should stay out of your life! They will not check on someone just because the family is concerned about safety, they have to be told you have heard the person threaten to kill themselfs or someone else saying you wanted to go to a KKK meeting is not considered a threat in this state it is considered a mentally ill person right!

I am surprised that Lousiana will help in those situations.

Steff M, Claremore (7/23/2009 8:52:30 AM)

Human 1. I think you may have mental issues. Shut up already.