Johnsonman, (11/26/2009 1:13:31 PM)

I already try to shop locally whenever I can, so this won't change my spending patterns. It would help if the city governments would limit themselves to city services though.

I hope Tulsa gets stung really bad on sales tax this holiday season, mainly because of all the money Tulsa has wasted on unnecessary stuff like a baseball stadium and a convention center, all built while the city's streets were crumbling away. The roadwork going on right now wouldn't be happening if not for federal money. The city should not be building anything at all that isn't strictly infrastructure until they can ensure the people they attract won't lose their cars in potholes along the way.

Why did the convention center and baseball stadium have to go in the middle of downtown anyway? Traffic and parking were already a nightmare down there, and this isn't going to help matters a single bit. It would have been far more cost effective for them to build both the stadium and convention center on the outskirts of town, say either east or west, where they could have enough room to build the attraction AND parking AND infrastructure to support these things. Plus, the land would have been a lot cheaper than right down in the middle of the downtown district. On top of all that, putting these attractions on the outskirts of town would mean people would have to travel the town to get from place to place instead of it being all in one tiny little area, which would have helped businesses all over town instead of just those in a tiny little area. It was either stupid, or there was some land deals and money changing hands, but there certainly wasn't any thought into the future of these attractions put into it.

But, I digress. I plan to spend plenty in the satellite towns around Tulsa, but not a nickel in Tulsa itself. As far as I'm concerned, Tulsa can either implode, or they can start managing money for the betterment of the city instead of a few special interests. Until they change their ways, they get no tax money from me.

oldrustytulsa, Tulsa (11/26/2009 1:50:31 PM)

Dang, right all the City of Tulsa wants is to Tax and spend, As we drive on dark streets, without the street lines painted, Maybe just a little more for the working folks, not all for the elite.Sure gets tiresom, always giving and not much getting.

Charley, (11/26/2009 2:11:15 PM)

Politicians are famous for promising & not fulfilling their promises. City Budgets are through the roof, if we got something for our taxes, no one would squawk. You can't give a politician too much money, they invented the "Money Black Hole".... Politicians squander our tax money, it is free for them to do so.

Tell Lamson's Loosers to cough up some cash, since they have a new home downtown. Try telling the next Rock Star, that visits the BOK Center to split his ticket take with the Tulsa City Management (<<< Oxymoron).

I hate to drive around Tulsa, the streets are the poorest I've seen in a major city & they have been bad for 30 years I know of.

r0rschach, (11/26/2009 2:12:48 PM)

and I'm urging cities not to rely on sales tax as their primary income....funny how that works eh?

FUTURE WORLD, Tulsa (11/26/2009 2:25:01 PM)

A lesson learned to diversify city revenue streams.

Thunder196, Tulsa (11/26/2009 2:41:17 PM)

The fringe benefits must be in jeopardy.

bearwolf, Tulsa (11/26/2009 3:04:42 PM)

This is a lesson to be learned by the so called leaders in Tulsa that voters have the last word in screwups by politicans not only by our vote but by spending of our money. The revenue stream is just fine. You are now noticing that spending of our money is actually a check and balance toward irresponsible government reserved to us..the citizens. Perhaps someday a Tulsa government offical will finally realize there is more to Tulsa than the local oligarchy.

Local "special interests" who have been doing what they wish with Tulsa government funds have finally drained the pond. Live with it!

im4osu, Broken Arrow (11/26/2009 4:46:00 PM)

“We’re not very good right now to be completely honest,” says Stoops

corntrader19, (11/26/2009 4:52:33 PM)

Johnsonman: You are right about that. Cities seem to sqaunder taxpayer's hard earned money on foolishness. When I lived in Tulsa, city officials were more concerned about planting pitunias around Riverside Drive then building a jail to house criminals. A serial rapist was on the loose and Tulsa Police reminded me of the Keystone Cops trying to catch the guy. After I returned to Texas, the same thing happened in Dallas. Police Officers didn't have enough vehicles to patrol because their cars were so old they were breaking down regularly. Do they spend money on police cars? Noooo! They are too interested in a stupid garden walkway near a bridge downtown. I hope people stay home this year and deliver a big goose egg to retailers. I am also sick and tired of whining retailers!

Elusive, Owasso (11/26/2009 5:08:50 PM)

I do shop locally as much as possible but depends on where the best deals are as well.

confederateU, (11/26/2009 5:09:35 PM)

I AM SICK OF HIGH PROPERTY TAXES and always INCREASING PROPERTY TAXES IN TULSA OKLAHOMA. I'll be doing ALL my CHRISTMAS shopping over the internet.

NO SALES TAX or shipping charges if I do it right!

RollinOkie, (11/26/2009 6:08:43 PM)

Well, because the local governments in our area of NE Oklahoma will not ALLOW some stores to build and move in and provide jobs where they are needed DESPERATELY,we are and have been shopping at the small mom and pop stores first and then if we need other things, jump on the (should have been paid off)turnpike and and go shop in Joplin Mo. As a person that has worked for one of the city governments in the past, i know for a fact that some companies and chain stores we tole outright, We don't need you here. We are doing just fine. Now these small communities whine and beg for shoppers to come spend thier money. Sorry clowns it aint happening in my house and quite a few other homes and my friends tell me also. So sad-to bad. We won't let you waste out tax monies.

Stratolifter, (11/26/2009 6:59:49 PM)

I would agree with doing the internet shopping. Saves gas time money taxes and so convenient to have the packages arrive at your front door.

heynow, (11/26/2009 7:15:20 PM)

Eventually states will start enforcing the Use Tax (what you're supposed to pay in lieu of Sales Tax for online purchases) through audits, so scoff at the law at your own peril.

FUTURE WORLD, Tulsa (11/26/2009 7:24:56 PM)

I would expect internet sales for small gifts will be hot about now.

truth fairy, (11/26/2009 7:28:06 PM)

Internet shopping is greatly responsible for the dwindling revenues of small local businesses, as well as shortages in sales tax monies. Remember travel agencies?

The majority of property tax goes to the school district where it is located.

Neither the BOK Center or Driller Stadium were paid for out of the general city fund, and streets are funded by bonds.
The BOK Center and placement of the Driller Stadium, as well as the development and revitalization of downtown were carefully planned to encourage conventions and events that will ensure future sales tax revenue for Tulsa. A city the size of ours must participate and compete for these markets, or else the local economy will suffer.
I don't always agree with all of the projects that the city has prioritized, but deliberately boycotting businesses within the community you live appears to me simply as bad citizenship.

jsludge, tulsa (11/26/2009 7:40:20 PM)

Another season of buying the christmas spirit. The old crumbly roads of oklahoma (they're not just bad in tulsa) lend to the rustic charm of the state. The baseball stadium is funded by private donations, taxes from the area it's in, and the Drillers, so it's not like that money would have been there for streets anyway. the convention center's at the fairgrounds last i checked, johnsonman. I'm sure you'll complain about that too.
It's not surprising the cities are going broke because there's a lot of broke people around right now not spending money because they can barely buy beans.

my view, Sand Springs (11/26/2009 8:06:51 PM)

It pays to shop locally, 70 percent of a city tax structure comes from sales tax.

st470, (11/26/2009 8:24:26 PM)

I wonder if the Oklahoma Highway Patrol will beat people up if they don't shop locally.

Ron Ballew, Lawton (11/27/2009 12:02:06 AM)

Products are pretty much standardized with mass production, so quality is the same for a product regardless of where it is purchased.

That makes price the primary reason to decide where to buy something. In a free interprise economic system people shop for the best price. This makes their limited supply of money go farther.

If a local business expects to sell something it has to compete on price with national chain stores and with stores that sell on the internet.

If a local business expects charity it will have to go to the Chamber of Commerce and ask for a handout. Local businesses are not going to get charity from customers.

FUTURE WORLD, Tulsa (11/27/2009 12:07:35 AM)

Exactly Ron, if retailers cut some profit out they might have a merry holiday season after all.

truth fairy, (11/27/2009 1:23:04 AM)

The big box and discount stores buy in volume, and enjoy tax exemptions from the cities they locate in, so they can afford to price their products lower. Small retailer's profits have already shrunk to the point where staying in business at all is a struggle. The Chamber of Commerce champions large corporations, and gives handouts to no small businesses.
Conservatives are fond of the expression "vote with your feet". You vote with your dollars with your spending choices, as well.
Supporting local businesses strengthens your community and helps ensure a healthy economy where you live.

Oh My, Around Tulsa (11/27/2009 7:42:51 AM)

My email inbox is loaded with offers of free shipping plus no sales taxes. I am even buying all my furniture over the internet--it is delivered to my front porch--I don't have to find someone with a pick up to haul it home nor pay the Tulsa store $50 or $100 to deliver it. All I have to do is get it in the front door. Great deal.

heydiddy, Tulsa (11/27/2009 9:56:02 AM)

Does that include buying the Tulsa World instead of the New York Times on black friday!

JAX, (11/27/2009 11:10:42 AM)

Must be nice to have some nice, local, shops. All there is in Sand Springs, is Wally World and an
Atwoods. And I am sure the City Father's, sure don't by much, at either of these..