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Reserve deputy who shot, killed man thought he drew his Taser, release says

A sheriff’s release recounts the fatal shooting of a suspect.

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SLAIN

Eric Courtney Harris: According to reports, Harris was shot as he was trying to escape arrest by an undercover Tulsa County reserve deputy.

Harris

Posted: Saturday, April 4, 2015 12:00 am | Updated: 1:07 am, Wed Apr 15, 2015.

A 73-year-old reserve deputy who shot and killed a fleeing suspect Thursday during an undercover operation believed he was holding a Taser, not a gun, when the shooting occurred.

The reserve deputy who shot the man is Robert Charles Bates, a Tulsa insurance company executive who was working undercover Thursday as a member of the Tulsa County Sheriff’s Office Violent Crimes Task Force.

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66 comments:

  • Robert Wilson posted at 4:52 pm on Mon, Apr 6, 2015.

    bdiwil-929 Posts: 2201

    "Clark said the Sheriff’s Office has more than 100 reserve deputies, all of whom go through the same training components as a normal deputy but with an abbreviated curriculum."

    The training is not the same.

    Grandpa did not need to be there, with a gun or a taser in hand.
    Same goes for Stanley Glanz.

    Make no mistake, Harris was a bad guy.

    Why does Stanley allow someone near 80 years old to get his thirills holding a gun on bad guys? More money funneled to Stanley's pet projects?

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 1:31 pm on Mon, Apr 6, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    Sour grapes? Sorry, reward is a benefit of accomplishment.

    But yes, so there's an example of one place where a more sensible policy works. Instead of our "You got a GED? Here's a gun" approach...

     
  • Bounty Hunter posted at 12:22 pm on Mon, Apr 6, 2015.

    dave_s-142 Posts: 3285

    Overpriced, underworked. Wow, one country that their officers carry no weapons out of how many countries in the world? Larry is proud of the fact too, that his country is one of the very, very few that does that. I say, if that is the case, move back and take batboy with him.

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 11:09 am on Mon, Apr 6, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    You can feel free to argue all you want with an LEO. They aren't gods. As more and more are caught breaking the law, more of us will correctly feel we don't have to comply with all the unnecessary commands. Let them know your name, and if you have a weapon. That is all that is required.

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 11:08 am on Mon, Apr 6, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    You have google? My time starts at $350 a hour if not...

    Regardless, these setups exist (the UK for one) and their police murder far fewer civilians.

     
  • Bounty Hunter posted at 5:21 pm on Sun, Apr 5, 2015.

    dave_s-142 Posts: 3285

    If that comment wasn't so serious, I'd be forced to laugh out loud. However the seriousness of it makes me wonder as to the intelligence level of the person it came from. Please list all countries who issue only a baton and taser to their officers. Then if possible, a list of those same countries who do not allow citizens to own weapons. Then, if you can, list the number of assaults and murders that are committed by the use of knives. That should keep you busy in the law office for a couple of days.

     
  • Bounty Hunter posted at 5:15 pm on Sun, Apr 5, 2015.

    dave_s-142 Posts: 3285

    Larry, failure to obey isn't a capital offense. However, what a person does, when they fail to obey a lawful order, and cause the officer to escalate the methods in which to arrest, could possibly lead to a capital offense. It isn't as easy as CJ would like for you to believe. What a normal person, and much less a practicing attorney perceives to be the difference between lawful and unlawful is completely different. It's kind of like "failing to yield at a yield sign". You could be right, and you could be dead right. The time to argue is in front of a judge, not on the side of the road.

     
  • Bounty Hunter posted at 10:03 am on Sun, Apr 5, 2015.

    dave_s-142 Posts: 3285

    Didn't take long for those who will feebly attempt to try this incident in the TW, instead of letting the actual court do their job. Experience would, I believe, keep some who have predicted what charges shoulda, woulda and coulda been filed, to hold out to see what actually happens. Let's see what happens next, instead of being 0-2.

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 7:57 am on Sun, Apr 5, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    charle-181 says:

    "This is the first incident of weapon application error that I ever recall hearing about. About the only thing I can think of to compare with would be someone confusing the gas pedal with the brake. Considering a charge of involuntary manslaughter might be appropriate in this case."

    Probably with a suspended sentence conditional on giving up his job.

     
  • Charles Shuttleworth posted at 7:34 am on Sun, Apr 5, 2015.

    charle-181 Posts: 3068

    This is the first incident of weapon application error that I ever recall hearing about. About the only thing I can think of to compare with would be someone confusing the gas pedal with the brake. Considering a charge of involuntary manslaughter might be appropriate in this case.

     
  • Jack E Smith posted at 3:06 am on Sun, Apr 5, 2015.

    Jack E Smith Posts: 298

    Sandpoint, ID
    7/8/14

    Jeanetta Marie Riley, mentally ill and pregnant was sitting alone in her car. She had a 3 inch paring knife and was threatening suicide. Fifteen seconds after arriving on the scene, three cops opened fire and murdered her in her car.

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 6:31 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    ykcor5-236: thank you. I need all the prayer I can get. I sincerely mean that.

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 6:28 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    None of that is what happened here though.

    The "officer" isn't even claiming this was a justified self defense shooting. He didn't intend to shoot him, he intended to tase him because he was fleeing, and he "accidentally" shot him.

     
  • Rocky Mitchell posted at 6:19 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    ykcor5-236 Posts: 783

    Eddie,
    I pray for you, particularly at this Christian Holy time.

    I am not afraid to say: JESUS, THANK YOU AND I SO LOVE YOU!

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 6:06 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    ykcor5-236 says:
    "All you talking eggheads out there, why can we not be unified?"

    Elementary, Watson, because blacks and other minorities do not want to be unified. In their mind (and maybe even in everyone elses) it's "us" and "them." Minorities are ultra sensitive to discrimination and unfair treatment and the liberal media and everyone else fuels the fire of race-baiting. That's why we'll never be unified, not until Christ comes back. We can never have peace in this world like it is. (It's not gloom and doom, it's the facts.)

     
  • Rocky Mitchell posted at 6:03 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    ykcor5-236 Posts: 783

    If you have what looks like a weapon and you do not obey to drop, then, sadly, (and in his sad defense,) you die. He was a stupid kid that did a stupid thing that was over in a second. Sad, but a reality...if i have a gun and you point what even looks like a gun at me, i will blow you away in a heartbeat. I cannot wait to ask you, 'That looks like a real weapon, is it?' [sad]

     
  • Rocky Mitchell posted at 5:54 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    ykcor5-236 Posts: 783

    Bringing race up, yet again.
    As a state, as a country, what do we need to do to make this country one of unity? Is that even possible now?
    If not, why? All you talking eggheads out there, why can we not be unified?

     
  • Dave young posted at 4:04 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    dryoun-349 Posts: 55

    Totally agree.

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 3:54 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    Well I think everyone dreads abuse, wherever it may come from. Maybe "fearing" is not the correct word.

     
  • Dave young posted at 3:53 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    dryoun-349 Posts: 55

    Again, the law breakers should fear them but those that don't should not. The ferguson thing was folks were targeted for minor violations (like jaywalking) resulting in fines. I don't think that would make anyone fear the police for their life. I've been cited for speeding in some very small towns that are speed traps, this doesn't make me fear the police.

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 3:40 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    dryoun-349: yes, but the folks in Ferguson would have something different to say on blacks fearing the police.

     
  • Dave young posted at 3:37 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    dryoun-349 Posts: 55

    I have black friends that don't fear the police either because the don't commit crimes.

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 3:33 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    dryoun-349: if you were black you might dang sure fear the police. lol

     
  • Dave young posted at 3:29 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    dryoun-349 Posts: 55

    5000 since 9/11, wow that's less than 1 per day. When there are exponetionally more violent crimes committed each day, that's not an epidemic. I don't commit crimes so I don't fear the police.

     
  • Larry Knoles posted at 3:20 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    larrya-128 Posts: 4657

    "Race" is a poorly-defined concept.

    There is a picture of the decedent at the top of this article. Draw your own conclusions.

     
  • Larry Knoles posted at 3:19 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    larrya-128 Posts: 4657

    I had no idea that "failure to obey" is a capital offense.

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 3:00 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    Failure to listen to everything an officer says is in no way grounds to shoot. You are legally allowed to resist an unlawful arrest.

    Maybe a more accurate question would be, how many people have the police shot someone that they didn't later allege were committing this fictional crime of "failing to obey".

    Like Tamir Rice, where the police said he failed to obey repeated commands to drop his toy, and the video shows them shooting him in less than 1 second after pulling up. Their blatant lie and falsification of a police report has still gone unpunished

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 2:55 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    Negligent homicide is a crime.

    The fact that some have gone unpunished in the history of the world doesn't mean it's a free for all..

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 2:54 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    Pay attention to the law. Someone's priors have no bearing on whether force can be used. The current incident and fleeing are alleged.

     
  • Don Bell posted at 2:49 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    kdshoe-117 Posts: 530

    "Americans should be more fearful..." By "Americans", do you mean felons and other people committing crimes that don't obey police commands? How many people that obeyed police commands have been shot Jack?

     
  • Jack E Smith posted at 1:50 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    Jack E Smith Posts: 298

    US Police Have Killed Over 5,000 Civilians Since 9/11
    Statistically speaking, Americans should be more fearful of the local cops than “terrorists.”

    The civilian death rate is nearly equal to the number of US soldiers killed in Iraq. In fact, you are 8 times more likely to be killed by a police officer than by a terrorist.

    The militarization of the police force has created what is being called an “epidemic of police brutality”

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 1:26 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    Yes, but nevermind that officers should be held to a higher standard than regular civilians, as far as being held accountable for such negligence.

     
  • Don Bell posted at 1:21 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    kdshoe-117 Posts: 530

    Wrong once again CJ - there are numeous examples of deaths by negligence like vehicle accidents, gun accidents, etc. where nobody ever goes to jail.

     
  • Don Bell posted at 1:18 pm on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    kdshoe-117 Posts: 530

    CJ - pay attention to the facts. He's not an alleged criminal, he's a 6x convicted felon that was illegally carrying a weapon.

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 11:20 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    Nothing you said disputed what I said.

    Hockadays killing is still under investigation, shooting someone with a knife is always going to be questionable. The question of if officers celebrated her killing, and treat it like a victory is a bigger question.

    The allegation Thomas back towards the officers was not witnessed by anyone other than the reporting officers. Also still under investigation

     
  • John Elwell posted at 11:00 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    tulsap-200 Posts: 13566

    Hockaday approach her boyfriend and the police officer with a knife.

    Thomas was shot when he back the car in the direction of the police. Who were there to serve a warrant for his arrest.

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 10:32 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    Dang! Get um, christ-128! woohooo

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 10:30 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    Umm. No.

    Hockaday was unarmed, and shot in front of her children. The bigger issue there is the allegation that the police in that department are getting skull tattoos for every civilian they kill. If you ever needed a clearer example of why police shouldn't have guns...

    Thomas was another where they shot someone merely for being in a car while the officers were on foot. The classic "he was coming right at us" defense, despite no independent witnesses seeing that.

    Funny how you can declare both "justified" despite the fact that both are still being actively investigated by their state Bureau of Investigations.

    I know it must be frightening to realize police aren't on your side, but pull your head out of the sand.

     
  • Dave young posted at 10:29 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    dryoun-349 Posts: 55

    I never saw anything on the race of the criminal which leads me to believe he is white. If he is white, there will be no national coverage. Sharpton, Jackson, and the like will not care one bit about this.

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 10:23 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    I'd take it further and say he belongs in jail. If either of us killed someone through negligence, we'd definitely be in cuffs right now.

    Ahh, the thin blue line. I guess we didn't donate enough to Sheriff Glanz's retirement fund to stay out of jail, like Mr. Bates did...

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 10:19 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    Just sounds like another good argument for disarming regular patrol officers to me. They are a danger to us all.

    Armed SWAT teams for when they're needed, and billy clubs and Tasers for everyone else. Police forces all over the world make do with this setup, and they kill far fewer civilians than ours do.

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 10:16 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    Yes, we should all feel sorry for the man who killed someone by mistake... Great victim blaming too

    This "Well, he was allegedly a criminal, I don't care if the police unjustifiably kill him in the street" mentality is dangerous, and has led us to the over-armed, and reckless police forces we currently have.

     
  • Gordon Mills posted at 9:52 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    Zyxulu Posts: 8967

    Had Eric Harris complied with orders by law enforcement he would not have been shot. My sympathies go to Mr. Bates.

     
  • Bud Wright posted at 9:46 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    gwrigh-104 Posts: 1427

    Jack - Sounds like the UK doesn't have the crime problems we have.

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 8:51 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    Well, I say again, if a cop confuses a taser with a gun, then they belong behind a desk only, for their safety, and others.

     
  • John Elwell posted at 8:45 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    tulsap-200 Posts: 13566

    I invite you to goggle the four examples that Smith has provided. You will find two that are questionable and will probably lead to prosecution. Both Hockaday and Thomas were justified.

     
  • John Elwell posted at 8:40 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    tulsap-200 Posts: 13566

    Bill, You can google a list of stories where police officers claimed to confused their weapons. And they are considerably younger than the reserve deputy. It happens quite often.

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 6:42 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    Roy: thank you...good to know!

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 6:38 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    Wow, Jack, that's an awesome bit of info. Thank you.

     
  • Roy Thomason posted at 5:19 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    roytho-400 Posts: 1165

    75% of the traffic tickets issued in Bixby are by the Bixby reserve officers. They send these yahoos to a two week school, approve their uniform and accessories, let them use their own vehicles, which are copies of the police departments, and tell them to go out and write as many tickets as you can.

    It is a huge windfall for the department. Half of their force in Bixby are volunteers who get their chuckles by pulling everyone they possibly can over and issuing a ticket.

    These guys make the Ferguson Police Department look like an elite S.W.A.T. team. Think of Barney Fife with a 9MM holding 14 in the clip plus one in the chamber.

     
  • Jack E Smith posted at 3:14 am on Sat, Apr 4, 2015.

    Jack E Smith Posts: 298

    American Police Killed More People in March (111) Than the Entire UK Police Have Killed Since 1900 A total of 111 people were killed by police in the United States in March of 2015. Since 1900, in the entire United Kingdom, 52 people have been killed by police.
    In March: Police beat Phillip White to death in New Jersey. He was unarmed.
    Police shot and killed Meagan Hockaday, a 26-year-old mother of three.
    Police shot and killed Nicholas Thomas, an unarmed man on his job at Goodyear in metro Atlanta.
    Police shot and killed Anthony Hill, an unarmed war veteran fighting through mental illness, in metro Atlanta.
    and 107 more.....................................

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 11:24 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    Waiting for Obama and Holder to start poking around in Tulsa....(and shame on the paper to conspire with the cops to cover up this crazy incident.)

     
  • Bill Yates posted at 10:18 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    WRY999-133 Posts: 6

    When Tulsa has a 72 year old County Sheriff it is not surprising you have a 73 year old "Deputy" Sheriff who confuses a gun with a Taser and a man tragically dies.

    Time for Tulsa to put an age limit on County Sheriffs and Deputy Sheriffs.

    This is not an age discrimination issue. This is a liability issue.

    Shame on Sheriff Glanz and shame on Tulsa County for allowing this to happen!

     
  • Cindy Keith posted at 9:10 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    cindyk-234 Posts: 9982

    wow... he was on the ground.....

    is this an acceptable "mistake"?

     
  • Janice Curtis posted at 7:48 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    liberalmind Posts: 159

    According to a local television station Bates was a long time police officer who was retired, not an insurance salesman. I am seeing a lot of information blaming the victim as an ex-con selling meth, other drugs and guns. The man was not at all street wise having spend most of his adult life in prison, and it is somewhat understandable that he tired to escape the sting operation. The entire incident stinks.

     
  • Tim Walden posted at 6:47 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    timjwa-252 Posts: 121

    When he cleaned his gun after he got home I hope he remembered it was loaded.

     
  • Rocky Mitchell posted at 6:47 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    ykcor5-236 Posts: 783

    Jeez, I am so tired of the black/white thing seems to always be the problem when it comes to enforcing the law.
    What do we need to do get more black police officers hired and on board and accountable for their actions in the protection of life and property? This should not be about black on white crimes or visa/versa: This is about CRIME.
    Please step forward and protect us all instead of 'race baiting'
    (And yes, I do not even particularly like my last sentence because it is so offensive, even to me. Sadly, I see it happening....[sad]

     
  • Charley Harjo posted at 6:43 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    tulsandn Posts: 532

    I had no idea reserve deputies had authority to carry a firearm. Maybe they should restricted to "observe and report" only. I love the canned response that the suspect reached near his waistband. Maybe all the suspects out there should note: Wear a belt. If you are running from hot pursuit and grab your waistband to keep you pants up, you just gave law enforcement an excuse to shoot you down.

     
  • Carlos Boomkin posted at 6:23 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    ryanba-295 Posts: 204

    Great planning. A sting at a store where many families go on a daily basis? 1 block from an elementary school? When you know this guy has a history and he is dealing ammunition? Everyone is lucky that he is the only one that was shot. Hey, but I'm sure they'll spin it and say they got their man

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 5:48 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    If you read, they're not even investigating it the shooting. Sounds familiar. 3--2---1...department of justice! lol

     
  • CJ Grant posted at 5:46 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    christ-128 Posts: 1466

    Well, it's at least negligent homicide, if not manslaughter. How curious the TCSO didn't arrest their friend for "accidentally" killing someone when none of us would have been afforded that same benefit of the doubt...

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 5:40 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    Thanks Karen. That confirms my suspicions that that article has been doctored to protect the old man and demonize the suspect. They are sooo transparent. They just don't want Al Sharpton and Eric Holder coming down on them. lol

     
  • Karen Bull posted at 5:32 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    ksbull Posts: 2

    Mr. Bates does not own Mercury Insurance. Mercury is a major insurance company. He is an agent that sells Mercury policies.

     
  • Larry Knoles posted at 5:09 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    larrya-128 Posts: 4657

    Sometimes I have commented that it's too bad a weapon hasn't been invented that would disable but not kill.

    StarTrek has a "phaser." We could call it something similar, like a "taser."

    But if the people carrying "tasers" can't distinguish them from traditional firearms, there could be bad consequences - on EITHER side of the weapon.

     
  • Eddie Santana posted at 5:07 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    eddiesanta Posts: 225

    Ok, 1. how stupid do you think readers are...and 2. If the dude is so senile he doesn't know a taser from a gun, what's he still doing on the force? SMH

     
  • John Elwell posted at 5:03 pm on Fri, Apr 3, 2015.

    tulsap-200 Posts: 13566

    Bates, thought he was firing his taser, but fire his gun instead...Not good.

     

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